Moving from BAC water over to BAC Saline: why, and how it went

Camlbacker

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Anyone tracking this space over the last several months knows that Gold Standard Hospira Bac Water has gotten a lot more expensive and a lot scarcer. Once Amazon stripped every BAC listing off their site and demand for Hospira left it hard to find for a few weeks — and pricier in the end — I started looking into substitutes. Like most people living in 2026, being gouged on price doesn't sit well with me; on top of that, for a few weeks nobody could be sure where to source a reliable BAC supply to keep their research running. That wasn't going to work for me. A few bottles of Lambda were ordered purely to check whether it behaved any differently from the Hospira. Three bottles in, I can't detect a difference, with two exceptions: Lambda ships in glass vials (which I much prefer), and the bottles are tall, narrow and easy to tip over, which clearly isn't ideal. So once they got their credit card processing sorted, I ordered a pile more Lambda, just in case the BAC water shit really hit the fan.

Some peps are spicy for me, as they are for plenty of you. Mots-C is the worst of the bunch in my case; it's also among the most valuable research I run continuously, so minimizing ISRs behooves me. Better dilution ratios help, but even diluting to 10mg/ml (4ml into a 40mg vial) doesn't wipe ISRs out entirely with standard BAC. Going up to 8 is possible, but given the current situation I'd rather stretch my BAC. BAC Saline keeps coming up in recent weeks — how and why it appears to improve ISRs — and the price is clearly better: I paid under $7 a bottle, and a case of 24 runs around $100.

Today my research moved to BAC Saline for reconstituting Mots-C and Korean Glutathione (Glutaone in its pink form, for those in the know). The Mots went in at 2ml per 40mg. Crystal clear after reconning, fully dissolved inside a couple of minutes. For the Gluta I began at 3ml into a 1200mg vial; it was slow to dissolve, so I added another 1ml and the problem was solved. Crystal clear. Gluta straight into the ventral glute has never given me much trouble, and if anything it's cleaner still on BAC Saline. Dose #1 was .5ml, so 150mg total. Uneventful. Mots-C is the more nuanced one. So far the ISR is minor (less than standard BAC would give, I believe), and tomorrow morning plus the following few days will tell me more as the work continues. The next vial gets 4ml, to see if that dials the ISR down further, or removes it altogether.

Should the community want it, I'll happily post updates on this particular subject as anything new and relevant comes up. Ask away if you have questions about anything. As I understand it, Reta and Tesa/Ipa don't play well with BAC Saline, so those stay untried for now. SS-31, Klow plus its individual components, NAD and probably a few others will get an attempt once I'm holding enough stock to sacrifice a vial to the research gods, should it come to that. As always, please keep the discourse non-violent, and thanks so much for reading.
 
You know, I'd love to see this discussed more thoroughly. My mom runs klow, epitalon, and tirz. Reta she'll never touch because she'll never need it. Five bottles of bac water on her shelf will last at least a year, but the price keeps climbing and climbing. I've got two cases, so she'll never run out on my watch — but it got me wondering whether I actually know that those three (six, if you count klow's individual components) are fine with saline.
 
YES! Thank you for laying all this out! Earlier today I'd worked myself into a righteous tizzy over pH, reconstitution and spicy shots, so this is exactly the sort of thing I've been hunting for (plus some NaCl BAC is already on order here for the NAD+/SS-31/MOTS-C protocol). Watching this thread.
 
Camlbacker said:

Anyone tracking this space over the last several months knows that Gold Standard Hospira Bac Water has gotten a lot more expensive and a lot scarcer. Once Amazon stripped every BAC listing off their site and demand for Hospira left it hard to find for a few weeks — and pricier in the end — I started looking into substitutes. Like most people living in 2026, being gouged on price doesn't sit well with me; on top of that, for a few weeks nobody could be sure where to source a reliable BAC supply to keep their research running. That wasn't going to work for me. A few bottles of Lambda were ordered purely to check whether it behaved any differently from the Hospira. Three bottles in, I can't detect a difference, with two exceptions: Lambda ships in glass vials (which I much prefer), and the bottles are tall, narrow and easy to tip over, which clearly isn't ideal. So once they got their credit card processing sorted, I ordered a pile more Lambda, just in case the BAC water shit really hit the fan.

Some peps are spicy for me, as they are for plenty of you. Mots-C is the worst of the bunch in my case; it's also among the most valuable research I run continuously, so minimizing ISRs behooves me. Better dilution ratios help, but even diluting to 10mg/ml (4ml into a 40mg vial) doesn't wipe ISRs out entirely with standard BAC. Going up to 8 is possible, but given the current situation I'd rather stretch my BAC. BAC Saline keeps coming up in recent weeks — how and why it appears to improve ISRs — and the price is clearly better: I paid under $7 a bottle, and a case of 24 runs around $100.

Today my research moved to BAC Saline for reconstituting Mots-C and Korean Glutathione (Glutaone in its pink form, for those in the know). The Mots went in at 2ml per 40mg. Crystal clear after reconning, fully dissolved inside a couple of minutes. For the Gluta I began at 3ml into a 1200mg vial; it was slow to dissolve, so I added another 1ml and the problem was solved. Crystal clear. Gluta straight into the ventral glute has never given me much trouble, and if anything it's cleaner still on BAC Saline. Dose #1 was .5ml, so 150mg total. Uneventful. Mots-C is the more nuanced one. So far the ISR is minor (less than standard BAC would give, I believe), and tomorrow morning plus the following few days will tell me more as the work continues. The next vial gets 4ml, to see if that dials the ISR down further, or removes it altogether.

Should the community want it, I'll happily post updates on this particular subject as anything new and relevant comes up. Ask away if you have questions about anything. As I understand it, Reta and Tesa/Ipa don't play well with BAC Saline, so those stay untried for now. SS-31, Klow plus its individual components, NAD and probably a few others will get an attempt once I'm holding enough stock to sacrifice a vial to the research gods, should it come to that. As always, please keep the discourse non-violent, and thanks so much for reading.
Please do! That's a really interesting read on it.
 
Yes!! bac saline is sitting here for a mots-c trial because I'm scared, lol…Klow left me with ISR for 84 hours!! Please keep updating on how it goes.
 
@randompersonrandom While meandering through TG I ran into this PDF that appears to contradict other things I've read here and on TG about which peps are and aren't compatible with BAC Saline. Tirz being fine while Reta isn't is what I'd read. Going by this, every GLP plus Cagri/Elora carries the highest risk of any peptide, while Epitalon — which I also plan to use regularly from here on — sits in the lowest risk group. Every component of Klow lands in the lower risk categories, but it doesn't speak to Klow as a blend, nor to whether the blend might be inherently less stable than the individual peps (the age-old pep debate comes roaring back whether we like it or not), and therefore a problem for your mom. Once I've got a more substantial supply, I do intend to try BAC Saline with Klow at some point, unless — as with Reta and Tesa — I find strong evidence that it won't work. Like you, I've got enough BAC to last me a while if the experiment turns out star-crossed. Being able to use BAC Saline for Mots-C and SS-31 would be a win for me; anything beyond that is a bonus.

Bacteriostatic Saline vs "Naked" Lypholized Pucks

For my part, keeping ISRs and costs down while retaining control of my supply for the items I use regularly matters a lot. Those are my main considerations. There are no citations in it, so for all I know the chart was pulled out of someone's armpit and dressed up in chemistry mumbo jumbo above my pay grade. Anyone with more knowledge here, feel free to weigh in.

@Alc23 On ISR with Klow: I ran into plenty of trouble with it as well when I first started, including ISRs that hung around for several days. I've since eliminated any injection site reactions from Klow, and would suggest the following, in order of importance (as I see it anyway, your mileage may vary a bit): 1) Go in at a 90 degree angle into the ventral glute (side-butt). Needle length doesn't appear to matter for me, though I don't use anything under 8mm, nor anything long enough to technically count as intramuscular. With Klow I've noticed deeper is better, hence the 90 degree angle. (With Mots-C, FYI, I studiously avoid any anaphlaxis risk by using the shortest needle and keeping the shot as near the skin surface as I can.) 2) Use plenty of BAC Water ie: 5ml per vial of Klow 80 3) Let the mixture come up close to room temperature before injecting and 4) Add extra KPV if need be. Klow is one of the best tools in this space for the people who need it, and I hate seeing it skipped over ISRs. Same goes for Mots-C — just with a different injection technique, as discussed above.
 
Camlbacker said:

@randompersonrandom While meandering through TG I ran into this PDF that appears to contradict other things I've read here and on TG about which peps are and aren't compatible with BAC Saline. Tirz being fine while Reta isn't is what I'd read. Going by this, every GLP plus Cagri/Elora carries the highest risk of any peptide, while Epitalon — which I also plan to use regularly from here on — sits in the lowest risk group. Every component of Klow lands in the lower risk categories, but it doesn't speak to Klow as a blend, nor to whether the blend might be inherently less stable than the individual peps (the age-old pep debate comes roaring back whether we like it or not), and therefore a problem for your mom. Once I've got a more substantial supply, I do intend to try BAC Saline with Klow at some point, unless — as with Reta and Tesa — I find strong evidence that it won't work. Like you, I've got enough BAC to last me a while if the experiment turns out star-crossed. Being able to use BAC Saline for Mots-C and SS-31 would be a win for me; anything beyond that is a bonus.

Bacteriostatic Saline vs "Naked" Lypholized Pucks

For my part, keeping ISRs and costs down while retaining control of my supply for the items I use regularly matters a lot. Those are my main considerations. There are no citations in it, so for all I know the chart was pulled out of someone's armpit and dressed up in chemistry mumbo jumbo above my pay grade. Anyone with more knowledge here, feel free to weigh in.

@Alc23 On ISR with Klow: I ran into plenty of trouble with it as well when I first started, including ISRs that hung around for several days. I've since eliminated any injection site reactions from Klow, and would suggest the following, in order of importance (as I see it anyway, your mileage may vary a bit): 1) Go in at a 90 degree angle into the ventral glute (side-butt). Needle length doesn't appear to matter for me, though I don't use anything under 8mm, nor anything long enough to technically count as intramuscular. With Klow I've noticed deeper is better, hence the 90 degree angle. (With Mots-C, FYI, I studiously avoid any anaphlaxis risk by using the shortest needle and keeping the shot as near the skin surface as I can.) 2) Use plenty of BAC Water ie: 5ml per vial of Klow 80 3) Let the mixture come up close to room temperature before injecting and 4) Add extra KPV if need be. Klow is one of the best tools in this space for the people who need it, and I hate seeing it skipped over ISRs. Same goes for Mots-C — just with a different injection technique, as discussed above.
Thanks! I'll definitely give that a go…I'm adding some lido/epi to the mix too, and waiting on a pen to make the glute injection easier🙏🤞🏼🍀 kpv went in recently and I think it's a keeper! Holding off on mots-c until the epi pen arrives, lol, but not joking!
 
A great test would be analysing degradation at 0/15/30/45 days across a select group of peptides in BAC Saline. Mots-C, Tirz, Reta, Epitalon and BPC, say. Reta may already have been done, but I haven't seen that test — only assumptions that saline would be detrimental based on Reta's structure. Degradation tests of these peps with regular BAC do exist, I believe, so this would be an excellent follow-up.
 
Camlbacker said:

Anyone tracking this space over the last several months knows that Gold Standard Hospira Bac Water has gotten a lot more expensive and a lot scarcer. Once Amazon stripped every BAC listing off their site and demand for Hospira left it hard to find for a few weeks — and pricier in the end — I started looking into substitutes. Like most people living in 2026, being gouged on price doesn't sit well with me; on top of that, for a few weeks nobody could be sure where to source a reliable BAC supply to keep their research running. That wasn't going to work for me. A few bottles of Lambda were ordered purely to check whether it behaved any differently from the Hospira. Three bottles in, I can't detect a difference, with two exceptions: Lambda ships in glass vials (which I much prefer), and the bottles are tall, narrow and easy to tip over, which clearly isn't ideal. So once they got their credit card processing sorted, I ordered a pile more Lambda, just in case the BAC water shit really hit the fan.

Some peps are spicy for me, as they are for plenty of you. Mots-C is the worst of the bunch in my case; it's also among the most valuable research I run continuously, so minimizing ISRs behooves me. Better dilution ratios help, but even diluting to 10mg/ml (4ml into a 40mg vial) doesn't wipe ISRs out entirely with standard BAC. Going up to 8 is possible, but given the current situation I'd rather stretch my BAC. BAC Saline keeps coming up in recent weeks — how and why it appears to improve ISRs — and the price is clearly better: I paid under $7 a bottle, and a case of 24 runs around $100.

Today my research moved to BAC Saline for reconstituting Mots-C and Korean Glutathione (Glutaone in its pink form, for those in the know). The Mots went in at 2ml per 40mg. Crystal clear after reconning, fully dissolved inside a couple of minutes. For the Gluta I began at 3ml into a 1200mg vial; it was slow to dissolve, so I added another 1ml and the problem was solved. Crystal clear. Gluta straight into the ventral glute has never given me much trouble, and if anything it's cleaner still on BAC Saline. Dose #1 was .5ml, so 150mg total. Uneventful. Mots-C is the more nuanced one. So far the ISR is minor (less than standard BAC would give, I believe), and tomorrow morning plus the following few days will tell me more as the work continues. The next vial gets 4ml, to see if that dials the ISR down further, or removes it altogether.

Should the community want it, I'll happily post updates on this particular subject as anything new and relevant comes up. Ask away if you have questions about anything. As I understand it, Reta and Tesa/Ipa don't play well with BAC Saline, so those stay untried for now. SS-31, Klow plus its individual components, NAD and probably a few others will get an attempt once I'm holding enough stock to sacrifice a vial to the research gods, should it come to that. As always, please keep the discourse non-violent, and thanks so much for reading.
Nothing of value to add from me. Just want to give kudos for 'behooves' — never came across that word before and had to Google it. Truly, you learn something new here every day.
 
Flash-BCR said:

Just to be clear on my end, does BAC Saline carry the .9% benzyl alcohol too? thx
Yes, that's Hospira BAC Saline , so you get both .9% NACL and .9% Benzyl Alcohol
 
Camlbacker said:

Anyone tracking this space over the last several months knows that Gold Standard Hospira Bac Water has gotten a lot more expensive and a lot scarcer. Once Amazon stripped every BAC listing off their site and demand for Hospira left it hard to find for a few weeks — and pricier in the end — I started looking into substitutes. Like most people living in 2026, being gouged on price doesn't sit well with me; on top of that, for a few weeks nobody could be sure where to source a reliable BAC supply to keep their research running. That wasn't going to work for me. A few bottles of Lambda were ordered purely to check whether it behaved any differently from the Hospira. Three bottles in, I can't detect a difference, with two exceptions: Lambda ships in glass vials (which I much prefer), and the bottles are tall, narrow and easy to tip over, which clearly isn't ideal. So once they got their credit card processing sorted, I ordered a pile more Lambda, just in case the BAC water shit really hit the fan.

Some peps are spicy for me, as they are for plenty of you. Mots-C is the worst of the bunch in my case; it's also among the most valuable research I run continuously, so minimizing ISRs behooves me. Better dilution ratios help, but even diluting to 10mg/ml (4ml into a 40mg vial) doesn't wipe ISRs out entirely with standard BAC. Going up to 8 is possible, but given the current situation I'd rather stretch my BAC. BAC Saline keeps coming up in recent weeks — how and why it appears to improve ISRs — and the price is clearly better: I paid under $7 a bottle, and a case of 24 runs around $100.

Today my research moved to BAC Saline for reconstituting Mots-C and Korean Glutathione (Glutaone in its pink form, for those in the know). The Mots went in at 2ml per 40mg. Crystal clear after reconning, fully dissolved inside a couple of minutes. For the Gluta I began at 3ml into a 1200mg vial; it was slow to dissolve, so I added another 1ml and the problem was solved. Crystal clear. Gluta straight into the ventral glute has never given me much trouble, and if anything it's cleaner still on BAC Saline. Dose #1 was .5ml, so 150mg total. Uneventful. Mots-C is the more nuanced one. So far the ISR is minor (less than standard BAC would give, I believe), and tomorrow morning plus the following few days will tell me more as the work continues. The next vial gets 4ml, to see if that dials the ISR down further, or removes it altogether.

Should the community want it, I'll happily post updates on this particular subject as anything new and relevant comes up. Ask away if you have questions about anything. As I understand it, Reta and Tesa/Ipa don't play well with BAC Saline, so those stay untried for now. SS-31, Klow plus its individual components, NAD and probably a few others will get an attempt once I'm holding enough stock to sacrifice a vial to the research gods, should it come to that. As always, please keep the discourse non-violent, and thanks so much for reading.
There's definitely interest in it. Based on user experiences I've put together a list of compatible/incompatible compounds in this recent thread, and I'm hopeful people will keep sharing how BAC NaCl behaves with different compounds so we can build up a very thorough picture of successes and failures.

Bacteriostatic Sodium Chloride-Compatible Compounds

/community-link/thread/19357/
 
Camlbacker said:

Flash-BCR said:

Just to be clear on my end, does BAC Saline carry the .9% benzyl alcohol too? thx
Yes, that's Hospira BAC Saline , so you get both .9% NACL and .9% Benzyl Alcohol
...and I believe your point was that BAC Saline can/may ease ISR on the spicier pepes like GHK-Cu, Mots-c and SS31?...
 
Flash-BCR said:

Camlbacker said:

Flash-BCR said:

Just to be clear on my end, does BAC Saline carry the .9% benzyl alcohol too? thx
Yes, that's Hospira BAC Saline , so you get both .9% NACL and .9% Benzyl Alcohol
...and I believe your point was that BAC Saline can/may ease ISR on the spicier pepes like GHK-Cu, Mots-c and SS31?...
Yep, it genuinely does help. The mechanism is this:

Dos-Dox said:


Spicy Peps - Regular BAC is hypotonic and forces water into the cells, which can cause some swelling and stinging. BAC SC is isotonic, matching human tissue osmolarity. This means there’s no gradient, so reduced swelling and pain.

Click to expand...
 
Dos-Dox said:

Flash-BCR said:

Camlbacker said:

Flash-BCR said:

Just to be clear on my end, does BAC Saline carry the .9% benzyl alcohol too? thx
Yes, that's Hospira BAC Saline , so you get both .9% NACL and .9% Benzyl Alcohol
...and I believe your point was that BAC Saline can/may ease ISR on the spicier pepes like GHK-Cu, Mots-c and SS31?...
Yep, it genuinely does help. The mechanism is this:

Dos-Dox said:


Spicy Peps - Regular BAC is hypotonic and forces water into the cells, which can cause some swelling and stinging. BAC SC is isotonic, matching human tissue osmolarity. This means there’s no gradient, so reduced swelling and pain.

Click to expand...
Thanks for the pointer back to the NaCL compatibility thread! I'll read through that today!...I'd just casually stumbled on a mention of BAC Saline a week or three back, and what perked me up of course was that it would help with some of these peptides. Being a relative noob, this use/benefit was news to me, though I had seen BAC Saline on some of the supply sites. Went straight to one of my go-to supply sites and ordered 3 bottles (Monday, I think, is when they land). Today I was going to recon some GHK-Cu, as I'd pretty much settled on the KPV, BPC and TB500 protocols I've been working on for the last couple of months. Mots-C, SS-31 and NAD are all earmarked for a protocol with GHK, probably in the fall, but I wanted a solo run of GHK first...I don't typically get ISR, but I was a bit leery of GHK, so glad to have better information on the BAC Saline, thanks!... 👍
 
Flash-BCR said:

Camlbacker said:

Flash-BCR said:

Just to be clear on my end, does BAC Saline carry the .9% benzyl alcohol too? thx
Yes, that's Hospira BAC Saline , so you get both .9% NACL and .9% Benzyl Alcohol
...and I believe your point was that BAC Saline can/may ease ISR on the spicier pepes like GHK-Cu, Mots-c and SS31?...

@Flash-BCR

Yes — Dos-Dox covers it in more scientific terms just above, on hypotonic versus isotonic. As far as user experience with this research goes, minimizing or even eliminating ISR from Mots-C specifically is my most urgent goal. It's one of my most important tools, and as nearly anyone who's used it knows, it can be a pain in the ass. Plenty of people are missing out on a tool that could really help them, purely because the ISRs make it more trouble than it's worth.

ISRs from Klow are gone for me using the technique I laid out above — GHK-CU on its own I've never used:

1) Go in at a 90 degree angle into the ventral glute (side-butt). Needle length doesn't seem to matter for me, though nothing under 8mm is in my kit, nor anything long enough to count technically as intramuscular. Deeper is better with Klow, hence the 90 degree angle. (With Mots-C, FYI, anaphlaxis risk is something I studiously avoid by using the shortest needle and keeping the shot as near the skin as I can.) 2) Use plenty of BAC Water ie: 5ml per vial of Klow 80 3) Let the mixture come up close to room temperature before injecting and 4) Add extra KPV if need be.

To my mind those same rules should apply as well, or nearly as well, to GHK-CU alone.
 
@Flash-BCR Here's a small excerpt from something interesting @eidos posted the other day re: NaCL & MOTS-C, GHK-Cu and NAD ( /community-link/post/211372/ ):

eidos said:


For my personal use, I add 0.9% NaCl (without BA) to the SS31 MOTS-c or GHK-Cu, which last 5, 10, and 20 days. When using a pen, this reduces the risk of introducing bugs that can be introduced more likely with a syringe.

It doesn't sting anymore, and the isotonic solution has eliminated the hardening. (MOTSc in BA really hurts). If it reassures you, take some BAC Saline.

Click to expand...
(FYI, he's in the EU, where reconstitution solutions frequently skip the benzyl alcohol)
 
HouseCat said:

@Flash-BCR Here's a small excerpt from something interesting @eidos posted the other day re: NaCL & MOTS-C, GHK-Cu and NAD ( /community-link/post/211372/ ):

eidos said:


For my personal use, I add 0.9% NaCl (without BA) to the SS31 MOTS-c or GHK-Cu, which last 5, 10, and 20 days. When using a pen, this reduces the risk of introducing bugs that can be introduced more likely with a syringe.

It doesn't sting anymore, and the isotonic solution has eliminated the hardening. (MOTSc in BA really hurts). If it reassures you, take some BAC Saline.

Click to expand...
(FYI, he's in the EU, where reconstitution solutions frequently skip the benzyl alcohol)
Very nice!..and timely too! Yours must have been the posts with the NaCL mention — as I said above, my ears perked right up when I read it...Quality material up here in the GLP1Chat interwebs today!... 👍
 
0.9% NaCl (without BA) has been in use here for a good month now across 2S31, MOTS-c, and GHK-Cu. No reaction, no more induration, no more bruising. Switching to the 3x.05ml multipin had already cut down the problems with GHK-Cu, but it still sometimes caused bruising. MOTS-c is also getting diluted more than before. Pens with 32G 4mm Embecta 5-bevel needles (formerly BD).

For Tirz, Reta, and KPV I'm sticking with BA, whose cartridges last longer.

Another thread reported that NaCl works with Tirz; some is in Kwikpens, in fact.

Reta appears to aggregate with salinity. We'll have to wait on the pharmaceutical formulations and the patent for more.
 
HouseCat said:

@Flash-BCR Here's a small excerpt from something interesting @eidos posted the other day re: NaCL & MOTS-C, GHK-Cu and NAD ( /community-link/post/211372/ ):

eidos said:


For my personal use, I add 0.9% NaCl (without BA) to the SS31 MOTS-c or GHK-Cu, which last 5, 10, and 20 days. When using a pen, this reduces the risk of introducing bugs that can be introduced more likely with a syringe.

It doesn't sting anymore, and the isotonic solution has eliminated the hardening. (MOTSc in BA really hurts). If it reassures you, take some BAC Saline.

Click to expand...
(FYI, he's in the EU, where reconstitution solutions frequently skip the benzyl alcohol)
Luckily, a few years of teaching got me into the habit of saying everything twice.

Luckily, a few years of teaching got me into the habit of saying everything twice.
 
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