Considering HGH Use

[CNCCurrency]

lessthanhalf said:

Sharing that kind of information seems worthwhile to me. My own data matched it exactly, so I'd guess it came from the same place. On here, and even more so on meso, what I've noticed is that most people carry a mistaken picture of what normal levels look like. Based on what they report using, and above all on what bodybuilders are able to use, it becomes very easy to walk away thinking that 4iu a day and above isn't a high dose. For younger people, 2iu or less at least sits nearer to physiological, yet the truth is nobody actually knows the long-term consequences of hgh use, particularly among older users taking it for visceral fat reduction or to hold onto muscle mass, which looks like the most common reason here. The long-term studies simply don't exist, only a handful of short-term ones plus animal work. Declining gh is quite typical as people age, and even more so with obesity, but it matters to keep in mind that no medical recommendations support using it in those situations, since the risks are believed to outweigh the benefits. It wouldn't shock me if wellness clinics and celebrity doctors were using it, but that doesn't make it safe.

Secretagogues may be somewhat safer, since they don't push levels up as far as hgh does, but there's still no evidence of long-term safety. Short-term gains in things like visceral fat, lipids or body composition have turned up in studies of tesamorelin in HIV patients, yet with so many animal studies linking gh deficiency to better life expectancy, you genuinely need long-term safety data to have any real sense of long-term safety, and that probably won't materialize, because Doctors generally view it as a bad safety bet, which makes long-term studies hard to justify.

I'm being a bit of a hypocrite here, since I take 1.5iu/day (igf-1 hasn't been checked yet, though I intend to). My assumption is that 15mg tirz plus 5mg of reta ought to be enough to keep blood glucose from rising, but that will be checked too. My reasoning: given the high overall health risks I carry, and that if I put back some or all of the 54% weight I've lost, my odds of another 10 years of reasonable health drop toward zero (not a common risk profile), the possible small extra risks from hgh are probably smaller than the benefit I get from helping keep weight/fat off. Probably unprovable logic, but it makes sense to me. That logic won't apply to the vast majority of people on this forum, who sit at more normal risk levels, where the risks of hgh or secretagogues, or ghrelin agonists, are very likely greater than the benefits or are simply unknown.

At first, my glucose and hgb went up, yet within 2 months both returned to normal.

 

[lessthanhalf]

I'm crossing my fingers that research showing cardiac benefits from low-dose HGH ends up translating to people. I've got mild left atrial and ventricular enlargement along with a slightly lower ejection fraction, which lands me in class b heart failure — structural changes are present but I'm not experiencing symptoms. My assumption is that years of severe obesity brought this on. When I get another echo in 6 months, I should know whether this was a wise move or not; regardless, there's a 1-2% yearly chance it progresses into actual heart failure, and that figure would climb sharply if I put weight back on.

Conversely, larger HGH doses are well known to trigger cardiac enlargement and heart failure. Over on Meso, folks frequently self-medicate with statins and antihypertensives to offset some of the cardiovascular downsides of running high-dose androgens and HGH. That approach makes sense on its face, but I'm skeptical it could bring the added risks anywhere close to baseline. I recall a post from last year by a 33 yo on Meso who suffered a heart attack — he made it through, evidently without major damage — yet it's still rare and extremely young for someone fit and healthy to experience that.

 

[Nopenada]

CNCCurrency said:

Not for know it all's

A solid baseline for those new to this:

1 mg = 3 IU

1 IU = 0.33 mg

Where to start:

• Under 30 years old:

1.2 – 1.5 IU daily (0.4 – 0.5 mg/day) (patients coming off pediatric treatment may need more)

• 30-60 years old:

0.6 – 0.9 IU daily (0.2 – 0.3 mg/day)

• Over 60 years old:

0.3 -0.6 IU daily (0.1-0.2 mg/day)

Anyone with diabetes, or who tends toward insulin resistance / glucose intolerance, ought to begin at the lowest dose (0.3 -0.6 IU daily) no matter their age.

Subcutaneous shots are typically given at night so they mirror the body's natural overnight GH release.

Raising the dose (titration):

Every 1 to 2 months, bump it up by 0.3 -0.6 IU daily (0.1-0.2 mg/day), guided by how you respond clinically, blood IGF-1 readings, side effects, and personal factors like insulin resistance / glucose intolerance.

Yeah, this is yet another thing that keeps me from starting it. I hadn't done any research on converting mg to IU. I've got 15IU vials stashed for later, and I was basically figuring it was a 1 to 1 swap.

I'm over here laughing at myself because my vendor asked me to verify the vial quantities on my order, and I assumed she was just making sure I truly wanted those tiny 5mg Reta bottles. Turns out she was trying to figure out why on earth I'd need that much HGH—enough to take down a horse.

P.S. If you ever catch me doing something dumb, don't hesitate to call me out!

 

[chavez636]

45 year old guy here — 5 days a week I'm on the mats for jiu Jitsu plus lifting weights. For the last 2 months my HGH dose has been 4iu daily, and these past few days my left wrist has been killing me with carpal tunnel as a side effect. Cutting the dose in half, down to 2iu, is clearly what I have to do now. Take it from me, at your age HGH is not something you need — it's money and time down the drain with nothing to show for it. Just push harder in training and take in loads of protein, that'll get you way more gainz than hopping on HGH.

 

[CNCCurrency]

chavez636 said:

45 year old guy here — 5 days a week I'm on the mats for jiu Jitsu plus lifting weights. For the last 2 months my HGH dose has been 4iu daily, and these past few days my left wrist has been killing me with carpal tunnel as a side effect. Cutting the dose in half, down to 2iu, is clearly what I have to do now. Take it from me, at your age HGH is not something you need — it's money and time down the drain with nothing to show for it. Just push harder in training and take in loads of protein, that'll get you way more gainz than hopping on HGH.

Guys like you put people at risk!!! Take a look at this person—begins at 4 iu and then can't figure out why carpal tunnel shows up. I'd bet your hgb numbers are through the roof too; the bigger worry would be sludgy blood and a stroke, SMH. What medical degree or any credentials do you have to call it a waste??? Anyone reading this should get that. He's just some random guy, and that's merely his take, which amounts to basically nothing

 

[Raptorrunner]

Nopenada said:

CNCCurrency said:

Not for know it all's

A solid baseline for those new to this:

1 mg = 3 IU

1 IU = 0.33 mg

Where to start:

• Under 30 years old:

1.2 – 1.5 IU daily (0.4 – 0.5 mg/day) (patients coming off pediatric treatment may need more)

• 30-60 years old:

0.6 – 0.9 IU daily (0.2 – 0.3 mg/day)

• Over 60 years old:

0.3 -0.6 IU daily (0.1-0.2 mg/day)

Anyone with diabetes, or who tends toward insulin resistance / glucose intolerance, ought to begin at the lowest dose (0.3 -0.6 IU daily) no matter their age.

Subcutaneous shots are typically given at night so they mirror the body's natural overnight GH release.

Raising the dose (titration):

Every 1 to 2 months, bump it up by 0.3 -0.6 IU daily (0.1-0.2 mg/day), guided by how you respond clinically, blood IGF-1 readings, side effects, and personal factors like insulin resistance / glucose intolerance.

Yeah, this is yet another thing that keeps me from starting it. I hadn't done any research on converting mg to IU. I've got 15IU vials stashed for later, and I was basically figuring it was a 1 to 1 swap.

I'm over here laughing at myself because my vendor asked me to verify the vial quantities on my order, and I assumed she was just making sure I truly wanted those tiny 5mg Reta bottles. Turns out she was trying to figure out why on earth I'd need that much HGH—enough to take down a horse.

P.S. If you ever catch me doing something dumb, don't hesitate to call me out!

There's a detail you seem to have overlooked. Each vial you purchased contains 15 iu, so no conversion calculations are necessary. At 2 i/u per injection, that works out to 75 injections per kit. Running a 5 on, 2 off schedule gives you 15 weeks of supply.

 

[CNCCurrency]

Raptorrunner said:

Nopenada said:

CNCCurrency said:

Not for know it all's

A solid baseline for those new to this:

1 mg = 3 IU

1 IU = 0.33 mg

Where to start:

• Under 30 years old:

1.2 – 1.5 IU daily (0.4 – 0.5 mg/day) (patients coming off pediatric treatment may need more)

• 30-60 years old:

0.6 – 0.9 IU daily (0.2 – 0.3 mg/day)

• Over 60 years old:

0.3 -0.6 IU daily (0.1-0.2 mg/day)

Anyone with diabetes, or who tends toward insulin resistance / glucose intolerance, ought to begin at the lowest dose (0.3 -0.6 IU daily) no matter their age.

Subcutaneous shots are typically given at night so they mirror the body's natural overnight GH release.

Raising the dose (titration):

Every 1 to 2 months, bump it up by 0.3 -0.6 IU daily (0.1-0.2 mg/day), guided by how you respond clinically, blood IGF-1 readings, side effects, and personal factors like insulin resistance / glucose intolerance.

Yeah, this is yet another thing that keeps me from starting it. I hadn't done any research on converting mg to IU. I've got 15IU vials stashed for later, and I was basically figuring it was a 1 to 1 swap.

I'm over here laughing at myself because my vendor asked me to verify the vial quantities on my order, and I assumed she was just making sure I truly wanted those tiny 5mg Reta bottles. Turns out she was trying to figure out why on earth I'd need that much HGH—enough to take down a horse.

P.S. If you ever catch me doing something dumb, don't hesitate to call me out!

There's a detail you seem to have overlooked. Each vial you purchased contains 15 iu, so no conversion calculations are necessary. At 2 i/u per injection, that works out to 75 injections per kit. Running a 5 on, 2 off schedule gives you 15 weeks of supply.

Huh? If you take 2 iu per day across 7 days, that adds up to 14 iu—unless a kit is what you mean. And why would cycling matter, since it acts on receptors differently compared with peptides?

 

[LabRatts]

zpped said:

rezzie said:

BillGoldberg said:

I'm with you. Also, 6-8 IU’s is definitely not a low amount. Quit paying attention to tiktok influencers who spout nonsense and have no idea what they're doing.

at my age, 2-3 IU would probably not be much above what my body already makes naturally, i figure. for real, visible results, a long-term 6-8 IU protocol strikes me as the safest option i could run.

i would really like to hear why being too young applies to me, given that doctors hand out the same thing i would be using, or in some cases double that amount, to children who are quite a bit younger than i am. (naturally, this assumes i follow the same safety steps they do).

Are you aware of which labs have to be tracked while using hgh, the way to order them, and the way to interpret the results? Do you have any idea what your baseline levels look like? Are you aware of which symptoms you should be on the lookout for?

The fact that doses are what you're discussing, rather than target response levels, strongly suggests you don't know enough to be going down this path.

100% behind this idea. Injecting HGH is not like injecting wolverine or Ghk-cu — the situation is more volatile. Acting on a whim is not something someone who wants to be healthy at three times their current age would do. Go forward with discernment.

 

[Nopenada]

A month has come and gone, and the only changes Tesa/ipa have brought are deeper sleep and more vivid dreams. One more month is what I'll give it, after which I'll come off and check whether the weight sitting around my midsection—which hasn't gotten any smaller—is simply water.

With Reta plus the hard training and cardio, everything else is coming down. The problem is that after a workout I stay sore for no less than 2 days, which makes me wonder if I've reached the age where a low-dose HGH switch deserves consideration.

Blah.

 

[IronPaw.]

CNCCurrency said:

lessthanhalf said:

Sharing that kind of information seems worthwhile to me. My own data matched it exactly, so I'd guess it came from the same place. On here, and even more so on meso, what I've noticed is that most people carry a mistaken picture of what normal levels look like. Based on what they report using, and above all on what bodybuilders are able to use, it becomes very easy to walk away thinking that 4iu a day and above isn't a high dose. For younger people, 2iu or less at least sits nearer to physiological, yet the truth is nobody actually knows the long-term consequences of hgh use, particularly among older users taking it for visceral fat reduction or to hold onto muscle mass, which looks like the most common reason here. The long-term studies simply don't exist, only a handful of short-term ones plus animal work. Declining gh is quite typical as people age, and even more so with obesity, but it matters to keep in mind that no medical recommendations support using it in those situations, since the risks are believed to outweigh the benefits. It wouldn't shock me if wellness clinics and celebrity doctors were using it, but that doesn't make it safe.

Secretagogues may be somewhat safer, since they don't push levels up as far as hgh does, but there's still no evidence of long-term safety. Short-term gains in things like visceral fat, lipids or body composition have turned up in studies of tesamorelin in HIV patients, yet with so many animal studies linking gh deficiency to better life expectancy, you genuinely need long-term safety data to have any real sense of long-term safety, and that probably won't materialize, because Doctors generally view it as a bad safety bet, which makes long-term studies hard to justify.

I'm being a bit of a hypocrite here, since I take 1.5iu/day (igf-1 hasn't been checked yet, though I intend to). My assumption is that 15mg tirz plus 5mg of reta ought to be enough to keep blood glucose from rising, but that will be checked too. My reasoning: given the high overall health risks I carry, and that if I put back some or all of the 54% weight I've lost, my odds of another 10 years of reasonable health drop toward zero (not a common risk profile), the possible small extra risks from hgh are probably smaller than the benefit I get from helping keep weight/fat off. Probably unprovable logic, but it makes sense to me. That logic won't apply to the vast majority of people on this forum, who sit at more normal risk levels, where the risks of hgh or secretagogues, or ghrelin agonists, are very likely greater than the benefits or are simply unknown.

I want to stop people from ending up with things like bigger hearts. If you listen to certain individuals here who can't even do iu to mg conversion, then what they tell you is simply unsafe!!

I'd really value some reliable guidance about dosing so I can avoid ending up with an enlarged heart. Someone told me that 3-5IU per day is fine?

My approach so far has been to ramp up gradually, and I'm now at 2IU taken twice daily — one dose right before bed after a 2hr fast, and the other at 4:30am as soon as I wake, then I keep fasting until 10am.

My goals are fat loss and better sleep. Would .45IU twice a day be sufficient for those results while staying safe?

 

[CNCCurrency]

Solid place to begin

NOTE: IU (international units) and mg (milligrams) are the units used to measure growth hormone:

1 mg = 3 IU

1 IU = 0.33 mg

Initial dosing:

• Under 30 years of age:

1.2 – 1.5 IU per day (0.4 – 0.5 mg/day) (patients moving over from pediatric treatment may need more)

• 30-60 years of age:

0.6 – 0.9 IU per day (0.2 – 0.3 mg/day)

• Over 60 years of age:

0.3 -0.6 IU per day (0.1-0.2 mg/day)

Anyone with diabetes, or who is prone to insulin resistance / glucose intolerance, should begin at the lowest dose (0.3 -0.6 IU per day) no matter what their age is.

Evening is the usual time for subcutaneous injections, so that they copy the body's natural overnight GH release.

Raising the dose (titration):

Every 1 to 2 months, raise the dose by 0.3 -0.6 IU per day (0.1-0.2 mg/day), guided by clinical response, blood IGF-1 levels, side effects, and individual factors like insulin resistance / glucose intolerance.

For older patients, longer gaps between increases and smaller steps up in dose may be needed.

What GH treatment is aiming for:

Unless side effects are significant, the target is blood IGF-I levels sitting in the middle of the normal range for the person's age and sex. A trial of higher GH doses can be considered to see whether more benefit follows, provided serum IGF-I levels stay inside the normal range and no side effects appear.

Monitoring:

IGF-1 levels are not a good indicator of GH status, yet using IGF-1 to monitor treatment of GH disorders in adulthood is now widely accepted, particularly since GH-dosing regimens for growth hormone deficiency have moved away from weight-based dosing (linked to overtreatment and side effects) toward individualized dose-titration strategies that keep IGF1 within target limits.[7]

Once maintenance doses are reached, every 6 months. Monitoring should cover clinical evaluation and assessment of side effects, blood IGF-1, fasting blood glucose levels, and T3, T4 and free T4, as well at lipid profile. Quality of life measurements may be done every 6 or 12 months.

Those already on thyroid, sex hormone or glucocorticoid treatment may need their doses adjusted once GH replacement therapy begins.

Things that may create a need for higher GH doses:

• Young patients regardless of onset type

• Low blood IGF-1 levels

• Addition of oral estrogen

• Change from transdermal to oral estrogen

• To induce breakdown of stored body fat (lipolysis)

Things that may create a need for lower GH doses:

• Elderly patients

• High blood IGF-1 levels

• Discontinuation of oral estrogen

• Change from oral to transdermal estrogen

• Co-treatment with testosterone

• Elevation in fasting blood glucose and/or HbA1c (i.e. worsening glucose tolerance)

• Side effects

 

[lessthanhalf]

Came across this — it gives a pretty solid rundown of research into hgh and similar compounds when it comes to human aging, plus plenty of instances showing the dosages that were used in those trials.

Frontiers | Growth hormone and aging: a clinical review



Aging is a complex biological process characterized by functional decline, reduced quality of life, and increased vulnerability to diseases such as type 2 di...

www.frontiersin.org

 

[Calm Logic]

lessthanhalf said:

Came across this — it gives a pretty solid rundown of research into hgh and similar compounds when it comes to human aging, plus plenty of instances showing the dosages that were used in those trials.



View attachment 10234



Frontiers | Growth hormone and aging: a clinical review



Aging is a complex biological process characterized by functional decline, reduced quality of life, and increased vulnerability to diseases such as type 2 di...

View attachment 10235


www.frontiersin.org

This is the finest piece about H/GH I've come across. Appreciate it!

 

[BillGoldberg]

Acromegaly and organomegaly get blown way out of proportion, in my view. I think it's overhyped. Any well-informed person will tell you the real issue is keeping IGF-1 elevated for long stretches.

 

[CNCCurrency]

BillGoldberg said:

Acromegaly and organomegaly get blown way out of proportion, in my view. I think it's overhyped. Any well-informed person will tell you the real issue is keeping IGF-1 elevated for long stretches.

I stick with a low dose, so organ growth isn't something I worry about. That said, if I were running the insane IU counts that some people talk about, it'd be a different story.

 

[RoadRash]

rezzie said:

I've been thinking about getting on hgh, likely at a low dose somewhere in the 6-8IUs per day range. I'm 18 yrs old, and my main goals are adding bonemass/musclemass while keeping my growth hormone supply elevated for general health. Since I'm on Reta and will be tracking my glucose, appetite shouldn't be an issue that pushes me toward diabetes. Since I was 15 I've already been using natural approaches to max out my test and growth hormone (I've had a beard since i was 16). It's clear I'm either past-puberty or at the end of it, so height gain isn't really my reason. I realize taking test is obviosuly much better, but Its so much more work, especially since I want to have kids and would have to deal with hgc and a million other ones to take to counteract the side effects. Its very tiring, and naturally maxing out my hgh is almost impossible, so if im going to take a peptide for it i would rather have it be exogenous instead of something like ipa/cjc.

Im wondering if any of you guys have been on a long-term lowdose of HGH and how it worked for you.

No way. AAS is off the table, and hgh is an absolute no. You're 18? What the hell?

 

[RoadRash]

IronPaw. said:

CNCCurrency said:

lessthanhalf said:

Sharing that kind of information seems worthwhile to me. My own data matched it exactly, so I'd guess it came from the same place. On here, and even more so on meso, what I've noticed is that most people carry a mistaken picture of what normal levels look like. Based on what they report using, and above all on what bodybuilders are able to use, it becomes very easy to walk away thinking that 4iu a day and above isn't a high dose. For younger people, 2iu or less at least sits nearer to physiological, yet the truth is nobody actually knows the long-term consequences of hgh use, particularly among older users taking it for visceral fat reduction or to hold onto muscle mass, which looks like the most common reason here. The long-term studies simply don't exist, only a handful of short-term ones plus animal work. Declining gh is quite typical as people age, and even more so with obesity, but it matters to keep in mind that no medical recommendations support using it in those situations, since the risks are believed to outweigh the benefits. It wouldn't shock me if wellness clinics and celebrity doctors were using it, but that doesn't make it safe.

Secretagogues may be somewhat safer, since they don't push levels up as far as hgh does, but there's still no evidence of long-term safety. Short-term gains in things like visceral fat, lipids or body composition have turned up in studies of tesamorelin in HIV patients, yet with so many animal studies linking gh deficiency to better life expectancy, you genuinely need long-term safety data to have any real sense of long-term safety, and that probably won't materialize, because Doctors generally view it as a bad safety bet, which makes long-term studies hard to justify.

I'm being a bit of a hypocrite here, since I take 1.5iu/day (igf-1 hasn't been checked yet, though I intend to). My assumption is that 15mg tirz plus 5mg of reta ought to be enough to keep blood glucose from rising, but that will be checked too. My reasoning: given the high overall health risks I carry, and that if I put back some or all of the 54% weight I've lost, my odds of another 10 years of reasonable health drop toward zero (not a common risk profile), the possible small extra risks from hgh are probably smaller than the benefit I get from helping keep weight/fat off. Probably unprovable logic, but it makes sense to me. That logic won't apply to the vast majority of people on this forum, who sit at more normal risk levels, where the risks of hgh or secretagogues, or ghrelin agonists, are very likely greater than the benefits or are simply unknown.

I want to stop people from ending up with things like bigger hearts. If you listen to certain individuals here who can't even do iu to mg conversion, then what they tell you is simply unsafe!!

I'd really value some reliable guidance about dosing so I can avoid ending up with an enlarged heart. Someone told me that 3-5IU per day is fine?

My approach so far has been to ramp up gradually, and I'm now at 2IU taken twice daily — one dose right before bed after a 2hr fast, and the other at 4:30am as soon as I wake, then I keep fasting until 10am.

My goals are fat loss and better sleep. Would .45IU twice a day be sufficient for those results while staying safe?

3iu. 5iu would be overdoing it.

 

[IronPaw.]

RoadRash said:

IronPaw. said:

CNCCurrency said:

lessthanhalf said:

Sharing that kind of information seems worthwhile to me. My own data matched it exactly, so I'd guess it came from the same place. On here, and even more so on meso, what I've noticed is that most people carry a mistaken picture of what normal levels look like. Based on what they report using, and above all on what bodybuilders are able to use, it becomes very easy to walk away thinking that 4iu a day and above isn't a high dose. For younger people, 2iu or less at least sits nearer to physiological, yet the truth is nobody actually knows the long-term consequences of hgh use, particularly among older users taking it for visceral fat reduction or to hold onto muscle mass, which looks like the most common reason here. The long-term studies simply don't exist, only a handful of short-term ones plus animal work. Declining gh is quite typical as people age, and even more so with obesity, but it matters to keep in mind that no medical recommendations support using it in those situations, since the risks are believed to outweigh the benefits. It wouldn't shock me if wellness clinics and celebrity doctors were using it, but that doesn't make it safe.

Secretagogues may be somewhat safer, since they don't push levels up as far as hgh does, but there's still no evidence of long-term safety. Short-term gains in things like visceral fat, lipids or body composition have turned up in studies of tesamorelin in HIV patients, yet with so many animal studies linking gh deficiency to better life expectancy, you genuinely need long-term safety data to have any real sense of long-term safety, and that probably won't materialize, because Doctors generally view it as a bad safety bet, which makes long-term studies hard to justify.

I'm being a bit of a hypocrite here, since I take 1.5iu/day (igf-1 hasn't been checked yet, though I intend to). My assumption is that 15mg tirz plus 5mg of reta ought to be enough to keep blood glucose from rising, but that will be checked too. My reasoning: given the high overall health risks I carry, and that if I put back some or all of the 54% weight I've lost, my odds of another 10 years of reasonable health drop toward zero (not a common risk profile), the possible small extra risks from hgh are probably smaller than the benefit I get from helping keep weight/fat off. Probably unprovable logic, but it makes sense to me. That logic won't apply to the vast majority of people on this forum, who sit at more normal risk levels, where the risks of hgh or secretagogues, or ghrelin agonists, are very likely greater than the benefits or are simply unknown.

I want to stop people from ending up with things like bigger hearts. If you listen to certain individuals here who can't even do iu to mg conversion, then what they tell you is simply unsafe!!

I'd really value some reliable guidance about dosing so I can avoid ending up with an enlarged heart. Someone told me that 3-5IU per day is fine?

My approach so far has been to ramp up gradually, and I'm now at 2IU taken twice daily — one dose right before bed after a 2hr fast, and the other at 4:30am as soon as I wake, then I keep fasting until 10am.

My goals are fat loss and better sleep. Would .45IU twice a day be sufficient for those results while staying safe?

3iu. 5iu would be overdoing it.

I've cut it down to 1.2IU twice daily—is that still too much?

 

[CNCCurrency]

IronPaw. said:

RoadRash said:

IronPaw. said:

CNCCurrency said:

lessthanhalf said:

Sharing that kind of information seems worthwhile to me. My own data matched it exactly, so I'd guess it came from the same place. On here, and even more so on meso, what I've noticed is that most people carry a mistaken picture of what normal levels look like. Based on what they report using, and above all on what bodybuilders are able to use, it becomes very easy to walk away thinking that 4iu a day and above isn't a high dose. For younger people, 2iu or less at least sits nearer to physiological, yet the truth is nobody actually knows the long-term consequences of hgh use, particularly among older users taking it for visceral fat reduction or to hold onto muscle mass, which looks like the most common reason here. The long-term studies simply don't exist, only a handful of short-term ones plus animal work. Declining gh is quite typical as people age, and even more so with obesity, but it matters to keep in mind that no medical recommendations support using it in those situations, since the risks are believed to outweigh the benefits. It wouldn't shock me if wellness clinics and celebrity doctors were using it, but that doesn't make it safe.

Secretagogues may be somewhat safer, since they don't push levels up as far as hgh does, but there's still no evidence of long-term safety. Short-term gains in things like visceral fat, lipids or body composition have turned up in studies of tesamorelin in HIV patients, yet with so many animal studies linking gh deficiency to better life expectancy, you genuinely need long-term safety data to have any real sense of long-term safety, and that probably won't materialize, because Doctors generally view it as a bad safety bet, which makes long-term studies hard to justify.

I'm being a bit of a hypocrite here, since I take 1.5iu/day (igf-1 hasn't been checked yet, though I intend to). My assumption is that 15mg tirz plus 5mg of reta ought to be enough to keep blood glucose from rising, but that will be checked too. My reasoning: given the high overall health risks I carry, and that if I put back some or all of the 54% weight I've lost, my odds of another 10 years of reasonable health drop toward zero (not a common risk profile), the possible small extra risks from hgh are probably smaller than the benefit I get from helping keep weight/fat off. Probably unprovable logic, but it makes sense to me. That logic won't apply to the vast majority of people on this forum, who sit at more normal risk levels, where the risks of hgh or secretagogues, or ghrelin agonists, are very likely greater than the benefits or are simply unknown.

I want to stop people from ending up with things like bigger hearts. If you listen to certain individuals here who can't even do iu to mg conversion, then what they tell you is simply unsafe!!

I'd really value some reliable guidance about dosing so I can avoid ending up with an enlarged heart. Someone told me that 3-5IU per day is fine?

My approach so far has been to ramp up gradually, and I'm now at 2IU taken twice daily — one dose right before bed after a 2hr fast, and the other at 4:30am as soon as I wake, then I keep fasting until 10am.

My goals are fat loss and better sleep. Would .45IU twice a day be sufficient for those results while staying safe?

3iu. 5iu would be overdoing it.

I've cut it down to 1.2IU twice daily—is that still too much?

Initial dosage:

• Under 30 years of age:

1.2 – 1.5 IU daily (0.4 – 0.5 mg/day) (higher amounts may be needed by those moving off pediatric care)

• Between 30 and 60 years of age:

0.6 – 0.9 IU daily (0.2 – 0.3 mg/day)

• Beyond 60 years of age:

0.3 -0.6 IU daily (0.1-0.2 mg/day)

Anyone with diabetes, or who tends toward insulin resistance / glucose intolerance, ought to begin at the smallest dose (0.3 -0.6 IU daily) no matter their age.

Injections under the skin are typically given at night so they copy the body's natural overnight GH release.

Raising the dose (titration):

Every 1 to 2 months, add 0.3 -0.6 IU daily (0.1-0.2 mg/day), guided by how the patient responds clinically, blood IGF-1 readings, adverse effects, and personal factors like insulin resistance / glucose intolerance.

For older patients, longer gaps between increases and smaller steps up may be required.

What GH treatment is aiming for:

Target blood IGF-I values in the mid part of the normal range for the person's age and sex, unless adverse effects are pronounced. A trial of larger GH doses can be considered to see whether extra benefit appears, provided serum IGF-I stays inside the normal range and no adverse effects occur.

Tracking:

Although IGF-1 readings do not reliably reflect GH status, using IGF-1 to follow treatment of adult GH disorders is now broadly endorsed, particularly since GH-dosing approaches for growth hormone deficiency shifted from weight-based dosing (linked to overtreatment and adverse effects) toward individualized dose-titration methods that hold IGF1 inside target limits.[7]

Every 6 months once maintenance doses are reached. Tracking ought to cover clinical assessment and review of adverse effects, blood IGF-1, fasting blood glucose, and T3, T4 and free T4, along with a lipid profile. Quality of life measures might be taken every 6 or 12 months.

Those receiving thyroid, sex hormone or glucocorticoid treatment at the same time may require dose changes once GH replacement begins.

Things that can make larger GH doses necessary:

• Younger patients, whatever the onset type

• Low blood IGF-1 readings

• Starting oral estrogen

• Switching from transdermal to oral estrogen

• Breaking down stored body fat (lipolysis)

Things that can make smaller GH doses necessary:

• Older patients

• High blood IGF-1 readings

• Stopping oral estrogen

• Switching from oral to transdermal estrogen

• Being treated with testosterone at the same time

• Rising fasting blood glucose and/or HbA1c (i.e. worsening glucose tolerance)

 

[SoCalGirl]

Nopenada said:

CNCCurrency said:

Not for know it all's

A solid baseline for those new to this:

1 mg = 3 IU

1 IU = 0.33 mg

Where to start:

• Under 30 years old:

1.2 – 1.5 IU daily (0.4 – 0.5 mg/day) (patients coming off pediatric treatment may need more)

• 30-60 years old:

0.6 – 0.9 IU daily (0.2 – 0.3 mg/day)

• Over 60 years old:

0.3 -0.6 IU daily (0.1-0.2 mg/day)

Anyone with diabetes, or who tends toward insulin resistance / glucose intolerance, ought to begin at the lowest dose (0.3 -0.6 IU daily) no matter their age.

Subcutaneous shots are typically given at night so they mirror the body's natural overnight GH release.

Raising the dose (titration):

Every 1 to 2 months, bump it up by 0.3 -0.6 IU daily (0.1-0.2 mg/day), guided by how you respond clinically, blood IGF-1 readings, side effects, and personal factors like insulin resistance / glucose intolerance.

Yeah, this is yet another thing that keeps me from starting it. I hadn't done any research on converting mg to IU. I've got 15IU vials stashed for later, and I was basically figuring it was a 1 to 1 swap.

I'm over here laughing at myself because my vendor asked me to verify the vial quantities on my order, and I assumed she was just making sure I truly wanted those tiny 5mg Reta bottles. Turns out she was trying to figure out why on earth I'd need that much HGH—enough to take down a horse.

P.S. If you ever catch me doing something dumb, don't hesitate to call me out!

Today I really needed a laugh. Picture that horse toppling over. My bad. Dark Horse is here!