Stalled, and now gaining while at 15 mg of Tirz

[Spork]

woundcarping said:

gusterbuster said:

I hate to be that guy, but are you certain your calories haven't shifted? Gaining on identical calories is very rare. Tirz doesn't burn calories — sure, there's some metabolic stuff, but mostly it's appetite suppression. Once you're in maintenance mode, it takes very little for one or two extra food items to start piling on calories.

The first thing I'd do in your shoes is hold the tirz dose steady and try a 6 day or 5 day interval, since plenty of people find the hunger comes back a day or two ahead of the next shot.

Don't hate, but that's almost certainly the issue. It comes down to either more calories going in or fewer being burned. The fix is eating less or moving more. To eat less you lean on more medicine, more tracking and conscious effort, or some mix of the two.

Spork said:

Yeah, with the food noise coming back, though this isn't exactly a full-blown crisis (I know "it's just 10 lbs" can land as trite - that's not how I mean it! You've done a great job so far - and honestly I'm jealous of anyone who reached goal and gets to work on the maintenance side now) you've still got a fair few options here.

Maybe the first thing worth trying is simply shifting your injection schedule so you pin 15mg on a 5 day cycle rather than 7.

Clearly that raises the effective total dose, though not by a ton, and it may quiet the noise across days 5,6 and 7 post-shot

That's a 40% jump in effective weekly dose. Equivalent to going from 15mg to 21mg.

40% hardly counts as a ton

My point being: with higher-dose trials still running (they haven't been halted over safety) and semaglutide now approved at 7.2mg doses, this is certainly safe enough to try, just to see whether side effects become a problem.

 

[finesse]

Your body has adapted, so your metabolic rate is lower. Meaning you're eating far, far more than you actually need to survive.

You'll want to work out your TDEE, then cut it down, to figure out what intake is needed for weight loss.

 

[woundcarping]

Spork said:

woundcarping said:

gusterbuster said:

I hate to be that guy, but are you certain your calories haven't shifted? Gaining on identical calories is very rare. Tirz doesn't burn calories — sure, there's some metabolic stuff, but mostly it's appetite suppression. Once you're in maintenance mode, it takes very little for one or two extra food items to start piling on calories.

The first thing I'd do in your shoes is hold the tirz dose steady and try a 6 day or 5 day interval, since plenty of people find the hunger comes back a day or two ahead of the next shot.

Don't hate, but that's almost certainly the issue. It comes down to either more calories going in or fewer being burned. The fix is eating less or moving more. To eat less you lean on more medicine, more tracking and conscious effort, or some mix of the two.

Spork said:

Yeah, with the food noise coming back, though this isn't exactly a full-blown crisis (I know "it's just 10 lbs" can land as trite - that's not how I mean it! You've done a great job so far - and honestly I'm jealous of anyone who reached goal and gets to work on the maintenance side now) you've still got a fair few options here.

Maybe the first thing worth trying is simply shifting your injection schedule so you pin 15mg on a 5 day cycle rather than 7.

Clearly that raises the effective total dose, though not by a ton, and it may quiet the noise across days 5,6 and 7 post-shot

That's a 40% jump in effective weekly dose. Equivalent to going from 15mg to 21mg.

40% hardly counts as a ton

My point being: with higher-dose trials still running (they haven't been halted over safety) and semaglutide now approved at 7.2mg doses, this is certainly safe enough to try, just to see whether side effects become a problem.

The earlier step from 12.5mg up to 15mg works out at 20%, and moving from 7 day pins to 5 day pins would double that.

Going past trialed dosing doesn't scare me, I spent months on 18-20mg of Reta weekly. Still, for putting on 10lb across 180 days, I wouldn't reach for a 40% increase as the cautious first-line experiment.

 

[Laxfinity]

Of all 3 I've been on or tried, Sema is the only one that ever shuts the food noise off for me. My suggestion would be to start at .25 and go from there. I have cagri sitting around but never used it, since sema handled it. Ozempic was my start 4 years ago.. so for me it's the "OG".

 

[Just A Cat]

This is the thing everybody dreads most.

It's also, for better or for worse, why I keep climbing on the soapbox about using the stretch where you're actually losing to build those new habits and that new lifestyle that will serve you later. They don't just make the losing easier — they'll help you hold onto the result better, longer and with less fight once maintenance starts.

What we're dealing with is a complicated, chaotic system. It involves nutrition, biology, the micro-biome, plus the very human pull back toward old habits.

Complicated... but let me boil it down to one thing.

Build some new habits. Otherwise you fall back into the old ones, and those are what built the old you.

 

[When_Pigs_Fly]

bamagirl26 said:

When_Pigs_Fly said:

I've run through every diet out there and even had RNY, yet Tirz is what nailed the weightloss for me. BUT. Over the last 6 months my weight has crept up slowly even though my exercise and calorie intake haven't changed. Roughly 10 pounds across that stretch (hey, for me that counts as slow). And I think the food noise is creeping back too. I'm still at 15 mg/week, pinned once a week. I've posted before asking whether I should add Reta or Cagri, but I wanted one more shot at hearing your all's opinion or experience about what worked for you. Or should I add sema? I'm honestly confused about which path is best.

So what has your experience been? I'm acting on this TODAY! I can't stand it. I can't face going back to where I came from.

Thanks ahead of time.

first of all, I'm really sorry you're going through this, and I know it must be a big source of anxiety, because the last thing you want is to end up back where you started. six months is a long stretch, yet those pounds can sneak on gradually. That's exactly how it went for me, and I never really saw it coming. So I think once you've lost weight, your body carries not just a muscle memory but a fat memory too, and it will turn on you fast if you slip even a little! That's cruel, but thankfully we've got some tools to work with! I think this might be the ideal case for adding Reta, since it nudges metabolic rate up a bit? Also, have you been under stress? Any cortisol shifts? Sleeping well? If I wanted to act TODAY: I think I'd commit to a week of very clean eating and see whether adding reta gives you a push in the right direction again. Don't beat yourself up about it tho, it sounds like you're already set on reining it in. Good luck! HYDRATE / TONS ** Edit, reading this back, I sound so patronizing. I'm trying to be supportive — sorry if it comes off as complete douchebaggery, and wishing u the best!

You

spanky2026 said:

I'm at a similar stage and my loss has come in dribbles these last few months. 2 weeks ago I went up to 15mg hoping for a boost, and nothing noticeable happened. I was jabbing every 6 days.

This past week I shook things up a bit....dropped the dose back to 12.5 but jabbed on day 5 instead of 6, so now it's a 5 day rotation. Running 12.5 every 5 days against 15 every 6 days ought to hold a same med level either way, six of one, etc.

But to my utter shock, weight is suddenly coming off DAILY, 3 pounds in 3 days! I can't explain it. I did add an electrolyte to my routine at the same time, though that's the only other change.

I genuinely can't explain it, just tossing it out there as a data point for you.

Really helpful — thanks.

 

[When_Pigs_Fly]

bamagirl26 said:

When_Pigs_Fly said:

I've run through every diet out there and even had RNY, yet Tirz is what nailed the weightloss for me. BUT. Over the last 6 months my weight has crept up slowly even though my exercise and calorie intake haven't changed. Roughly 10 pounds across that stretch (hey, for me that counts as slow). And I think the food noise is creeping back too. I'm still at 15 mg/week, pinned once a week. I've posted before asking whether I should add Reta or Cagri, but I wanted one more shot at hearing your all's opinion or experience about what worked for you. Or should I add sema? I'm honestly confused about which path is best.

So what has your experience been? I'm acting on this TODAY! I can't stand it. I can't face going back to where I came from.

Thanks ahead of time.

first of all, I'm really sorry you're going through this, and I know it must be a big source of anxiety, because the last thing you want is to end up back where you started. six months is a long stretch, yet those pounds can sneak on gradually. That's exactly how it went for me, and I never really saw it coming. So I think once you've lost weight, your body carries not just a muscle memory but a fat memory too, and it will turn on you fast if you slip even a little! That's cruel, but thankfully we've got some tools to work with! I think this might be the ideal case for adding Reta, since it nudges metabolic rate up a bit? Also, have you been under stress? Any cortisol shifts? Sleeping well? If I wanted to act TODAY: I think I'd commit to a week of very clean eating and see whether adding reta gives you a push in the right direction again. Don't beat yourself up about it tho, it sounds like you're already set on reining it in. Good luck! HYDRATE / TONS ** Edit, reading this back, I sound so patronizing. I'm trying to be supportive — sorry if it comes off as complete douchebaggery, and wishing u the best!

You

bamagirl26 said:

When_Pigs_Fly said:

I've run through every diet out there and even had RNY, yet Tirz is what nailed the weightloss for me. BUT. Over the last 6 months my weight has crept up slowly even though my exercise and calorie intake haven't changed. Roughly 10 pounds across that stretch (hey, for me that counts as slow). And I think the food noise is creeping back too. I'm still at 15 mg/week, pinned once a week. I've posted before asking whether I should add Reta or Cagri, but I wanted one more shot at hearing your all's opinion or experience about what worked for you. Or should I add sema? I'm honestly confused about which path is best.

So what has your experience been? I'm acting on this TODAY! I can't stand it. I can't face going back to where I came from.

Thanks ahead of time.

first of all, I'm really sorry you're going through this, and I know it must be a big source of anxiety, because the last thing you want is to end up back where you started. six months is a long stretch, yet those pounds can sneak on gradually. That's exactly how it went for me, and I never really saw it coming. So I think once you've lost weight, your body carries not just a muscle memory but a fat memory too, and it will turn on you fast if you slip even a little! That's cruel, but thankfully we've got some tools to work with! I think this might be the ideal case for adding Reta, since it nudges metabolic rate up a bit? Also, have you been under stress? Any cortisol shifts? Sleeping well? If I wanted to act TODAY: I think I'd commit to a week of very clean eating and see whether adding reta gives you a push in the right direction again. Don't beat yourself up about it tho, it sounds like you're already set on reining it in. Good luck! HYDRATE / TONS ** Edit, reading this back, I sound so patronizing. I'm trying to be supportive — sorry if it comes off as complete douchebaggery, and wishing u the best!

thanks for such a great reply. It's genuinely f'ing w my mind (again - as though food on its own wasn't already doing that!). I can tell that you get it. Thanks for the support.

 

[HereKittyKitty]

I run Tirz stacked with Survo. It's worked really well for me and keeps my Tirz runway intact. Every 6 days, 3 day offset.

Gave cagri a try. Probably coincidence, but after my first dose I was really sick for 24 hours. I couldn't make myself take it again. That was a harrowing second day of vacation last year.

 

[quicksilver80]

Unless a glucagon agonist is in the mix, these drugs don't really move weightloss. In the end it comes down to calories in and work output. I was cycling 24 miles a day and it made no difference at all until I cut my food intake. After that the weight practically melted off.

 

[woundcarping]

quicksilver80 said:

Unless a glucagon agonist is in the mix, these drugs don't really move weightloss. In the end it comes down to calories in and work output. I was cycling 24 miles a day and it made no difference at all until I cut my food intake. After that the weight practically melted off.

 

[AngieHolmes]

HereKittyKitty said:

Stace_wow said:

If simply burning more than you eat were enough, I'd already be a skinny legend.

Sometimes I think people lose sight of the fact that these drugs let those with metabolic disease finally see results from the actions they've been taking all along.

This. Every word of this.

CICO isn't the whole answer. The conventional wisdom has it wrong.

Makes me wonder whether this shows up more often in women. Men are certainly the loudest (and the most confident) when they deny it's real. Apparently it's inconceivable that anyone could have an experience they're unfamiliar with.

 

[Skidude]

AngieHolmes said:

HereKittyKitty said:

Stace_wow said:

If simply burning more than you eat were enough, I'd already be a skinny legend.

Sometimes I think people lose sight of the fact that these drugs let those with metabolic disease finally see results from the actions they've been taking all along.

This. Every word of this.

CICO isn't the whole answer. The conventional wisdom has it wrong.

Makes me wonder whether this shows up more often in women. Men are certainly the loudest (and the most confident) when they deny it's real. Apparently it's inconceivable that anyone could have an experience they're unfamiliar with.

I, for one, recognize that CICO has it's problems; counting calories out when you're targeting BMR is never right.

Accurately measuring calories is another hurdle, as is adjusting BMR as you shed weight.

Not sure gender needs to enter the debate, but I did share data on how Lilly was targeting fewer calories in order to lose weight.

Whether you can target BMR based on individual metabolizing performance may be contentious; what isn't contentious is that eating too much will make you gain weight.

 

[AngieHolmes]

Seasonal1 said:

4StrandKnot said:

When_Pigs_Fly said:

I've run through every diet out there and even had RNY, yet Tirz is what nailed the weightloss for me. BUT. Over the last 6 months my weight has crept up slowly even though my exercise and calorie intake haven't changed. Roughly 10 pounds across that stretch (hey, for me that counts as slow). And I think the food noise is creeping back too. I'm still at 15 mg/week, pinned once a week. I've posted before asking whether I should add Reta or Cagri, but I wanted one more shot at hearing your all's opinion or experience about what worked for you. Or should I add sema? I'm honestly confused about which path is best.

So what has your experience been? I'm acting on this TODAY! I can't stand it. I can't face going back to where I came from.

Thanks ahead of time.

My own experience? Sema has brought slow but steady progress.

My husband's story is different, unfortunately. He lost weight on Ozempic too, but his eating habits started slipping and he's put it back on.

I don't micromanage him. He's a grown man with an Ozempic prescription from his doc. Still, I live with the dude, yanno? I watch what he eats, and what his body looks like. Same as he watches what I eat and how my body looks.

For me Sema hasn't been a matter of injecting and watching the weight magically vanish. It has taken work. It still takes work. I still mess up.

This is the piece nobody wants to discuss. These aren't magic pills and shots. A lot of work goes into good results.

On another forum today I read someone complaining they'd been on Tirz for 8 months and hadn't lost a pound. I don't even know where you begin with a comment that goofy. Who sticks with a diet for 8 months with absolutely zero results. I review my weight daily, adjust as needed, and think back over the previous day's actions.

When my PCP first prescribed my meds, not a single word about diet or exercise was said. I'm not stupid, I understand we don't have magic fat burning pills today.

Congratulations on what you've achieved.

Comments along these lines show up quite often -- folks on the highest dose of their med for months on end with nothing coming off. It's mystifying. They start asking whether another compound should be stacked on. That typically sets off an argument over whether tolerance to these meds develops ("impossible!"), or whether the person is fooling themselves about their intake (rude, IMO).

My take is that these meds simply aren't fully understood. There are times when holding steady is the best the top dose can do. It feels like nothing is happening, but picture where we'd be without it.

Tweaking my diet/exercise/med regimen off a single day's numbers has never done anything for me, but if that works in your case, more power to ya! I need a longer stretch before real patterns show up.

 

[lessthanhalf]

If you have to count calories and deliberately restrict intake across a long stretch while on GLP drugs for them to do anything, then they aren't really working, or at best are helping a little. Why I see that as a problem: voluntary calorie restriction costs effort , and broadly it isn't sustainable, which essentially turns the whole thing back into a low calorie diet — something that may work for a while but usually has poor long term success rates.

The GLP drugs are supposed to cut appetite so you eat less and run a calorie deficit, without needing willpower, which is essentially why they work long term. And if that effect isn't there at decent doses, and the only route to weight loss is deliberately restricting calories, then you're most likely among the unfortunate 5-10% who respond poorly to them.

Plenty of people treat GLP drugs like a standard diet and exercise program — low doses, poor hunger control, deliberate calorie restriction — and set themselves up for a high risk of losing far less weight, or regaining it once tolerating the hunger becomes too hard over the long haul. So when I read replies to people who aren't losing, or barely losing, that push calorie counting and more exercise as the answer, I tend to disagree — not because those are bad ideas in themselves, just that they don't really deliver long term weight control, particularly for those with more severe obesity.

 

[Skidude]

lessthanhalf said:

If you have to count calories and deliberately restrict intake across a long stretch while on GLP drugs for them to do anything, then they aren't really working, or at best are helping a little. Why I see that as a problem: voluntary calorie restriction costs effort , and broadly it isn't sustainable, which essentially turns the whole thing back into a low calorie diet — something that may work for a while but usually has poor long term success rates.

The GLP drugs are supposed to cut appetite so you eat less and run a calorie deficit, without needing willpower, which is essentially why they work long term. And if that effect isn't there at decent doses, and the only route to weight loss is deliberately restricting calories, then you're most likely among the unfortunate 5-10% who respond poorly to them.

Plenty of people treat GLP drugs like a standard diet and exercise program — low doses, poor hunger control, deliberate calorie restriction — and set themselves up for a high risk of losing far less weight, or regaining it once tolerating the hunger becomes too hard over the long haul. So when I read replies to people who aren't losing, or barely losing, that push calorie counting and more exercise as the answer, I tend to disagree — not because those are bad ideas in themselves, just that they don't really deliver long term weight control, particularly for those with more severe obesity.

That matches my own situation pretty closely. I have not tracked a single calorie in more than a year, and I still eat whatever I feel like eating. Ice cream now and then, chorizo with eggs and cheese more often than I should admit, a good steak when the mood takes me - nothing is off limits. The only discipline I keep is paying attention to protein, fiber and overall nutrition quality.

The difference is that my weight is holding steady rather than creeping upward.

So if the number on the scale is climbing, the first thing I would look at is how much you are actually taking in.

 

[Stace_wow]

Guess I am the odd one out here. The tirz does settle the food noise for me, but the scale barely moves unless I put in serious work.

 

[Skidude]

Stace_wow said:

Guess I am the odd one out here. The tirz does settle the food noise for me, but the scale barely moves unless I put in serious work.

Do not get me wrong - back when losing was the goal, I tracked everything and I walked every day.

Now that I am at my goal I have no interest in dropping any further, so 15mg a week is all it takes to hold me where I am. I fill up faster and stop before I overdo it, since I have learned that pushing past that point upsets my stomach.

During the loss phase I followed a 16/8 intermittent fasting schedule, held to a 1200 calorie daily target and aimed for 10k steps a day.

On top of that I set daily protein and fiber goals, plus water and electrolytes every other day. All of it together took 27% off me in 7 months, 63lbs in total. Tirz made that possible, and I am aware I got a good response when plenty of people do not get one.