Is there truly a tirz effectiveness window, and should I increase my dose?

[DidntMakeBrownies]

I've been on 6 of tirz for 5 months, have lost 35 lbs, and want to drop another 45 to get near my goal. I figured slow and steady was fine since my losses are consistent, even if not huge, and I barely get side effects. Then I came across something saying tirz weight loss levels off around 72 weeks. If a third of that window is already gone, should I raise my dose to speed things up? Add Reta if I can ever work out how to order from China? Stalling out is something I'd really hate…

 

[FartfulCodger]

The 72-week taper is not something I've come across. My guess is that bumping the dose up would just bring any taper on sooner. With these drugs, one thing holds true: responses vary from person to person. If you do have a taper, it could arrive at a different point, or possibly never.

You're sitting in a lucky spot — dropping weight at a solid pace, and still able to go higher on your dose if you need to. My take would be to remain on your current course and see how it unfolds. Should you hit a plateau, that's when you raise the dose. And if another plateau comes, you still have options such as Cagrilintide or Reta. In my view, you're well positioned and there's no need to fret.

 

[woundcarping]

I haven't come across any research showing that bumping your dose once you've stalled leads to a significant boost in how well the peptide works.

You left out your starting weight, but if the plan is to shed 80lb, that isn't a slow-and-steady target for someone at a typical weight. Since December I've dropped 53lb and still have about 40lb left to lose. I switched to Reta for several reasons, and one of them is that it tends to produce a bigger drop in percentage of starting weight.

At the upper end, roughly 40% of trial participants on 15mg of Tirz shed 25% or more of their starting weight, yet they still hit a stall in about the same overall timeframe as the other study arms. Just 12-15% managed to lose 30% or more while on 15mg of Tirz. By contrast, 24% on Reta 12mg lost 30% or more.

Losing 35lb over 5 months works out to about 1.6lb/week. That's perfectly fine, but at that pace you'd need another 6-7 months, and you'd presumably have to be a high responder to lose that large a percentage on Tirz.

Calculated can be useful here. Personally, I can't see a real advantage in going slower than about 1% of body weight per week (~2.65lb/week).

 

[woundcarping]

FartfulCodger said:

The 72-week taper is not something I've come across. My guess is that bumping the dose up would just bring any taper on sooner. With these drugs, one thing holds true: responses vary from person to person. If you do have a taper, it could arrive at a different point, or possibly never.

You're sitting in a lucky spot — dropping weight at a solid pace, and still able to go higher on your dose if you need to. My take would be to remain on your current course and see how it unfolds. Should you hit a plateau, that's when you raise the dose. And if another plateau comes, you still have options such as Cagrilintide or Reta. In my view, you're well positioned and there's no need to fret.

Have plateaus really never come up in the research you've seen?

 

[chipsandsalsayall]

Over the past 12 months I've dropped 95 lbs using tirz alone. Results are still fairly solid (fat loss, quieting of noise, appetite reduction, and so on). That said, things have slowed down a bit. Right now I'm on 12.5mg, splitting the dose between Monday and Thursday. In my opinion, tirz still has plenty of room left before you'd need to bring Reta into the mix.

That said, I've got some Cag on hand, ready if a supplement becomes necessary. I've still got roughly 25 lbs to go. Best of luck!

 

[FlowerFairy]

DidntMakeBrownies said:

I've been on 6 of tirz for 5 months, have lost 35 lbs, and want to drop another 45 to get near my goal. I figured slow and steady was fine since my losses are consistent, even if not huge, and I barely get side effects. Then I came across something saying tirz weight loss levels off around 72 weeks. If a third of that window is already gone, should I raise my dose to speed things up? Add Reta if I can ever work out how to order from China? Stalling out is something I'd really hate…

Were it to have stopped, a lot of people would be running into trouble. Whether an increase is necessary, I can't say, though after 4 weeks bumping the dose up wouldn't be out of line.

FartfulCodger said:

The 72-week taper is not something I've come across. My guess is that bumping the dose up would just bring any taper on sooner. With these drugs, one thing holds true: responses vary from person to person. If you do have a taper, it could arrive at a different point, or possibly never.

You're sitting in a lucky spot — dropping weight at a solid pace, and still able to go higher on your dose if you need to. My take would be to remain on your current course and see how it unfolds. Should you hit a plateau, that's when you raise the dose. And if another plateau comes, you still have options such as Cagrilintide or Reta. In my view, you're well positioned and there's no need to fret.

I'm with you on that.

 

[woundcarping]

FlowerFairy said:

DidntMakeBrownies said:

I've been on 6 of tirz for 5 months, have lost 35 lbs, and want to drop another 45 to get near my goal. I figured slow and steady was fine since my losses are consistent, even if not huge, and I barely get side effects. Then I came across something saying tirz weight loss levels off around 72 weeks. If a third of that window is already gone, should I raise my dose to speed things up? Add Reta if I can ever work out how to order from China? Stalling out is something I'd really hate…

Were it to have stopped, a lot of people would be running into trouble. Whether an increase is necessary, I can't say, though after 4 weeks bumping the dose up wouldn't be out of line.

FartfulCodger said:

The 72-week taper is not something I've come across. My guess is that bumping the dose up would just bring any taper on sooner. With these drugs, one thing holds true: responses vary from person to person. If you do have a taper, it could arrive at a different point, or possibly never.

You're sitting in a lucky spot — dropping weight at a solid pace, and still able to go higher on your dose if you need to. My take would be to remain on your current course and see how it unfolds. Should you hit a plateau, that's when you raise the dose. And if another plateau comes, you still have options such as Cagrilintide or Reta. In my view, you're well positioned and there's no need to fret.

I'm with you on that.

A stall in results isn't the same thing as the drug quitting on you—it just means the scale settles and you hold steady. Nothing I've come across points to substantial weight coming back when the dose stays put over time. The medication continues to do its job; what happens is it carries you to a set point, and that's where you remain.

Where that set point lands appears to hinge mostly on how much you're taking, and there aren't studies showing that a "low and slow" climb winds up at the same destination as what the trials reported.

I haven't seen that moving up as fast as side effects permit produces worse outcomes than the trials, but I can't say the reverse holds either.

To be clear once more, I'm only talking about people like me—those with a lot of fat to lose—not someone trying to shed 10lb off a 200lb body (just as an example).

 

[FartfulCodger]

woundcarping said:

I haven't come across any research showing that bumping your dose once you've stalled leads to a significant boost in how well the peptide works.

You left out your starting weight, but if the plan is to shed 80lb, that isn't a slow-and-steady target for someone at a typical weight. Since December I've dropped 53lb and still have about 40lb left to lose. I switched to Reta for several reasons, and one of them is that it tends to produce a bigger drop in percentage of starting weight.

At the upper end, roughly 40% of trial participants on 15mg of Tirz shed 25% or more of their starting weight, yet they still hit a stall in about the same overall timeframe as the other study arms. Just 12-15% managed to lose 30% or more while on 15mg of Tirz. By contrast, 24% on Reta 12mg lost 30% or more.

Losing 35lb over 5 months works out to about 1.6lb/week. That's perfectly fine, but at that pace you'd need another 6-7 months, and you'd presumably have to be a high responder to lose that large a percentage on Tirz.

Calculated can be useful here. Personally, I can't see a real advantage in going slower than about 1% of body weight per week (~2.65lb/week).

If you're skeptical that raising the dose can boost how well it works, what led you to take 21mg of Reta over the course of 18 days?

 

[FartfulCodger]

woundcarping said:

I haven't come across any research showing that bumping your dose once you've stalled leads to a significant boost in how well the peptide works.

You left out your starting weight, but if the plan is to shed 80lb, that isn't a slow-and-steady target for someone at a typical weight. Since December I've dropped 53lb and still have about 40lb left to lose. I switched to Reta for several reasons, and one of them is that it tends to produce a bigger drop in percentage of starting weight.

At the upper end, roughly 40% of trial participants on 15mg of Tirz shed 25% or more of their starting weight, yet they still hit a stall in about the same overall timeframe as the other study arms. Just 12-15% managed to lose 30% or more while on 15mg of Tirz. By contrast, 24% on Reta 12mg lost 30% or more.

Losing 35lb over 5 months works out to about 1.6lb/week. That's perfectly fine, but at that pace you'd need another 6-7 months, and you'd presumably have to be a high responder to lose that large a percentage on Tirz.

Calculated can be useful here. Personally, I can't see a real advantage in going slower than about 1% of body weight per week (~2.65lb/week).

If you don't think increasing the dose can , then how did you come to take 21mg of Reta with in an 18-day span? Which study did you rely on to settle on that schedule?

 

[woundcarping]

FartfulCodger said:

woundcarping said:

I haven't come across any research showing that bumping your dose once you've stalled leads to a significant boost in how well the peptide works.

You left out your starting weight, but if the plan is to shed 80lb, that isn't a slow-and-steady target for someone at a typical weight. Since December I've dropped 53lb and still have about 40lb left to lose. I switched to Reta for several reasons, and one of them is that it tends to produce a bigger drop in percentage of starting weight.

At the upper end, roughly 40% of trial participants on 15mg of Tirz shed 25% or more of their starting weight, yet they still hit a stall in about the same overall timeframe as the other study arms. Just 12-15% managed to lose 30% or more while on 15mg of Tirz. By contrast, 24% on Reta 12mg lost 30% or more.

Losing 35lb over 5 months works out to about 1.6lb/week. That's perfectly fine, but at that pace you'd need another 6-7 months, and you'd presumably have to be a high responder to lose that large a percentage on Tirz.

Calculated can be useful here. Personally, I can't see a real advantage in going slower than about 1% of body weight per week (~2.65lb/week).

If you're skeptical that raising the dose can boost how well it works, what led you to take 21mg of Reta over the course of 18 days?

FartfulCodger said:

woundcarping said:

I haven't come across any research showing that bumping your dose once you've stalled leads to a significant boost in how well the peptide works.

You left out your starting weight, but if the plan is to shed 80lb, that isn't a slow-and-steady target for someone at a typical weight. Since December I've dropped 53lb and still have about 40lb left to lose. I switched to Reta for several reasons, and one of them is that it tends to produce a bigger drop in percentage of starting weight.

At the upper end, roughly 40% of trial participants on 15mg of Tirz shed 25% or more of their starting weight, yet they still hit a stall in about the same overall timeframe as the other study arms. Just 12-15% managed to lose 30% or more while on 15mg of Tirz. By contrast, 24% on Reta 12mg lost 30% or more.

Losing 35lb over 5 months works out to about 1.6lb/week. That's perfectly fine, but at that pace you'd need another 6-7 months, and you'd presumably have to be a high responder to lose that large a percentage on Tirz.

Calculated can be useful here. Personally, I can't see a real advantage in going slower than about 1% of body weight per week (~2.65lb/week).

If you don't think increasing the dose can , then how did you come to take 21mg of Reta with in an 18-day span? Which study did you rely on to settle on that schedule?

Where did I suggest that raising the dose wouldn't raise effectiveness? What I'm getting at is this: going low and slow compared with the trials may exhaust the time runway ahead of the dose runway, hitting that flatline that shows up everywhere across weight loss peptides and their different dosages.

Taking 21mg over 18 days in 12 shots while tapering off tirz with no sides really isn't that extreme. The aim was daily microdosing to speed up the loading phase and shorten the Tirz-to-Reta transition, and that worked.

In medical practice, accelerated loading approaches are used widely with many different compounds.

 

[DidntMakeBrownies]

So…perhaps around 8.5 mg? That would still leave space to increase?

 

[woundcarping]

DidntMakeBrownies said:

So…perhaps around 8.5 mg? That would still leave space to increase?

Honestly... 6mg sits in the gap between the trial doses of 5mg and 7.5mg. To me that doesn't come across as "wrong" at all. Going up is going up.

Some folks out there are on Tirz past 15mg/week and report barely any sides, and there are trials looking at higher doses too (though the actual amounts haven't been made public).

What were your starting weight, height, and age?

 

[lessthanhalf]

DidntMakeBrownies said:

I've been on 6 of tirz for 5 months, have lost 35 lbs, and want to drop another 45 to get near my goal. I figured slow and steady was fine since my losses are consistent, even if not huge, and I barely get side effects. Then I came across something saying tirz weight loss levels off around 72 weeks. If a third of that window is already gone, should I raise my dose to speed things up? Add Reta if I can ever work out how to order from China? Stalling out is something I'd really hate…

Nearly every study reports that weight reduction levels off to around zero past roughly a year, maybe a bit more, though not at 72 weeks. That said, those results come from a fixed dose. To my knowledge, there is no solid data either way on whether reaching that top weight-loss dose gradually or rapidly alters the overall pounds shed. Likewise, no strong evidence exists one way or the other about whether bumping up doses after a stall at a non-maximum level helps or not, yet plain reasoning and anecdotal reports point to more weight coming off when doses go up post-stall. I don't believe the one-year plateau is tied to time itself; it's simply the duration required to hit peak weight loss at whatever dose you're on.

The 72 weeks figure is merely the lengthiest follow-up completed to date, demonstrating that weight loss holds steady over that period provided the individual continues the medication at the dose that produced the loss.

Since I don't know your specific weight, height, and so on, if your aim is to drop 80lbs total, that likely means at least 25% and probably higher. Unless you're an exceptional responder, you'll likely have to push doses up to 15mg to achieve that level of loss.

Fast weight loss does carry downsides, chiefly feeling terrible, so it also hinges on your present rate of loss, hunger levels, and side effects at the current dose. And whether you feel okay or drained and exhausted. Keeping the process bearable makes it more sustainable over time, and it's the long-term upkeep of the loss that truly counts.

So you likely do need to raise doses to or near 15mg at some point, but the speed depends heavily on where things stand now.

 

[DidntMakeBrownies]

T

lessthanhalf said:

DidntMakeBrownies said:

I've been on 6 of tirz for 5 months, have lost 35 lbs, and want to drop another 45 to get near my goal. I figured slow and steady was fine since my losses are consistent, even if not huge, and I barely get side effects. Then I came across something saying tirz weight loss levels off around 72 weeks. If a third of that window is already gone, should I raise my dose to speed things up? Add Reta if I can ever work out how to order from China? Stalling out is something I'd really hate…

Nearly every study reports that weight reduction levels off to around zero past roughly a year, maybe a bit more, though not at 72 weeks. That said, those results come from a fixed dose. To my knowledge, there is no solid data either way on whether reaching that top weight-loss dose gradually or rapidly alters the overall pounds shed. Likewise, no strong evidence exists one way or the other about whether bumping up doses after a stall at a non-maximum level helps or not, yet plain reasoning and anecdotal reports point to more weight coming off when doses go up post-stall. I don't believe the one-year plateau is tied to time itself; it's simply the duration required to hit peak weight loss at whatever dose you're on.

The 72 weeks figure is merely the lengthiest follow-up completed to date, demonstrating that weight loss holds steady over that period provided the individual continues the medication at the dose that produced the loss.

Since I don't know your specific weight, height, and so on, if your aim is to drop 80lbs total, that likely means at least 25% and probably higher. Unless you're an exceptional responder, you'll likely have to push doses up to 15mg to achieve that level of loss.

Fast weight loss does carry downsides, chiefly feeling terrible, so it also hinges on your present rate of loss, hunger levels, and side effects at the current dose. And whether you feel okay or drained and exhausted. Keeping the process bearable makes it more sustainable over time, and it's the long-term upkeep of the loss that truly counts.

So you likely do need to raise doses to or near 15mg at some point, but the speed depends heavily on where things stand now.

I appreciate that way of looking at it. Losing 1.5 a week slowly is acceptable to me even if reaching goal takes ages, though moving up in dose is also fine if that becomes necessary. Next thing I want to look into is what Reta might contribute.

 

[Sarsippius]

Roughly 12 months is what you have before tolerance develops and hunger comes back. Keep that in mind when planning.

 

[woundcarping]

Sarsippius said:

Roughly 12 months is what you have before tolerance develops and hunger comes back. Keep that in mind when planning.

If that were true, it would mean the drug stops working for maintenance. I have not come across that in any trial results or in other people's reports, other than your case.

 

[Sarsippius]

woundcarping said:

Sarsippius said:

Roughly 12 months is what you have before tolerance develops and hunger comes back. Keep that in mind when planning.

If that were true, it would mean the drug stops working for maintenance. I have not come across that in any trial results or in other people's reports, other than your case.

That has been what happened to me on Reta. My wife, who began later than I did, is now starting to see the same thing. To keep my stall going, I have had to stack Cargi.

 

[woundcarping]

Sarsippius said:

woundcarping said:

Sarsippius said:

Roughly 12 months is what you have before tolerance develops and hunger comes back. Keep that in mind when planning.

If that were true, it would mean the drug stops working for maintenance. I have not come across that in any trial results or in other people's reports, other than your case.

That has been what happened to me on Reta. My wife, who began later than I did, is now starting to see the same thing. To keep my stall going, I have had to stack Cargi.

That's fascinating!

What were your beginning weight, the weight you maintain, and the dose you use for maintenance?

 

[Sarsippius]

Male, 6'4", aged 54. Started out at 350 lbs, now holding 225 lbs. Reta 12 mg every 7 days, with Cargri split at 2.25 mg.

 

[woundcarping]

Sarsippius said:

Male, 6'4", aged 54. Started out at 350 lbs, now holding 225 lbs. Reta 12 mg every 7 days, with Cargri split at 2.25 mg.

That is quite intriguing.

Has switching to Tirz crossed your mind?