How do you guys mitigate the cost of Bac water

PablinhoDoFavela said:


I just found out once opened Bac water vials have 28 days for use. Apparently it cant be frozen to last longer either.

I looked into 3ml bottles but apparently these are not safe for personal use.

How do you guys mitigate the prices?

Click to expand...
Click to expand...
28 days is just so you buy more, store it in a place that’s room temp or cold without sunlight and u can keep it for a while. And also, bac water is insanely cheap even if u only use it for 28 days. Bac water is like 10$ for 30ml
 
Don't know about y'all but I spend meaningful money on the peps. The cost of bac and supplies is nothing in comparison.

I have Nexus, Hospira, PGB bac water in my linen closet.
 
Bastogne22 said:


Where did you find this out? The labeling document on pfizer.com makes no mention of this. I have heard of 28 days for reconstituted peptides but never BAC water. Hospira prints an expiration date on the bottle that far exceeds 28 days and makes no mention of 28 days after opening.

Click to expand...
Click to expand...
I think he found it on gptchat:

✅ Best Way to Store Opened BAC Water

1. Refrigerate After Opening

  • Temperature: 2–8 °C (36–46 °F)
  • Refrigeration slows bacterial growth and preserves sterility.
  • Do not freeze (freezing can compromise the solution and vial integrity).
⚠️ Important Safety Notes

  • BAC water contains 0.9% benzyl alcohol, which inhibits bacterial growth but does not make it sterile forever.
 
I just put the bottle inside a empty script bottle or I also have caps for the bottle and put in the fridge. I put my 3ml vials inside some lancet bottle as they are small.
 
HereKittyKitty said:


Don't know about y'all but I spend meaningful money on the peps. The cost of bac and supplies is nothing in comparison.

I have Nexus, Hospira, PGB bac water in my linen closet.

Click to expand...
Click to expand...
What's this Nexus stuff?
 
I don't understand why insulin vials are 90 days, compounded sema and tirz are 90 days but the BAC water they (assumingly) are made with some say is 28 days. Did someone come up with 28 days because we are not using a sterile lab or is this for labs too?

I go 90 days in ziploc bag fridge with everything, sometimes a little longer if not visually bad. I filter everything to new vials and cross my fingers sometimes.

I would really like to see a group test of Hospira where they use all but 10ml and store it for 5 months (or longer) before sending for testing.
 
nitetrak said:


I don't understand why insulin vials are 90 days, compounded sema and tirz are 90 days but the BAC water they (assumingly) are made with some say is 28 days. Did someone come up with 28 days because we are not using a sterile lab or is this for labs too?

Click to expand...
Click to expand...
You're comparing something that is designed to be used by one person repeatedly VS something that is designed for medical staff to use in a shared environment with different practitioners of varying skill level all sharing the same vial.
 
tubby said:


Obviously if you're engaging in unsanitary practices and slowly contaminating the BAC vial over time you could run into a problem at some point, but if you're not injecting air into the vial (which some people apparently do),

Click to expand...
Click to expand...

hold up wait a minute
 
woundcarping said:


If you don’t give it air, it’ll suck air through the stopper when you withdraw the needle.

Click to expand...
Click to expand...
It will get the small amount of air contained in the needle when you originally insert the syringe, but that's about it. If you doubt this, try withdrawing the needle while you have the vial upside down and tell me how much air you see enter the vial during withdrawal.
 
Have you read the label on the Hospira 30ml bottle?

nitetrak said:


I don't understand why insulin vials are 90 days, compounded sema and tirz are 90 days but the BAC water they (assumingly) are made with some say is 28 days. Did someone come up with 28 days because we are not using a sterile lab or is this for labs too?

I go 90 days in ziploc bag fridge with everything, sometimes a little longer if not visually bad. I filter everything to new vials and cross my fingers sometimes.

I would really like to see a group test of Hospira where they use all but 10ml and store it for 5 months (or longer) before sending for testing.

Click to expand...
Click to expand...
There has been testing. I saw a graph posted on TG somewhere recently. Maybe do some online searching?
 
These documents will be helpful.

Also: PTDS did tests on BAC water and the % of alcohol in opened vials for and extended period of something like 90 to 120 days if I remember correctly. Most people walked away determining they could use the BAC for a much longer period of time than they previously assumed.

There is currently a Peppys member running an experiment he is reporting out in Peppys on the efficacy of BAC and filters in removing bacteria from solutions. Very interesting discussion for those who are members and wanting to follow along: https://chat.peppys.org/t/qualitative-testing-of-bac-on-bacterial-growth/49042/99
 
tubby said:


It will get the small amount of air contained in the needle when you originally insert the syringe, but that's about it. If you doubt this, try withdrawing the needle while you have the vial upside down and tell me how much air you see enter the vial during withdrawal.

Click to expand...
Click to expand...
… that’s how I know it will suck air😂

So will 3ml vials of reconstituted peptides, same as 10ml vials of oil.
 
woundcarping said:


… that’s how I know it will suck air😂

So will 3ml vials of reconstituted peptides, same as 10ml vials of oil.

Click to expand...
Click to expand...
Actually I put that to the test just now. Seems you either get no air bubbles or a couple small bubbles, depending on the speed you withdraw the needle from the BAC vial. I'd guess gauge of the needle might factor in a bit as well.
 
tubby said:


Just stop at the plasma and sperm banks for donations on the way to the BAC store and that should cover the cost. 😉

I've always scratched my head on the notion of an expiration date for BAC water. Obviously if you're engaging in unsanitary practices and slowly contaminating the BAC vial over time you could run into a problem at some point, but if you're not injecting air into the vial (which some people apparently do), what exactly is the aging concern people are fretting will happen in weeks to a few months?

I'm obviously aware of what the label and documentation from the manufacturer says, but neither addresses my question.

Click to expand...
Click to expand...
As I remember, at some point, maybe early 1980s, I think JCAHO made the 28 day requirement… But there was info out there of MDVs that were way past 6 months and being used… Tested and no growth on the medium.

YMMV

A lot depends on the integrity of the stopper after punctures and the level of sterile technique used.
 
tubby said:


Actually I put that to the test just now. Seems you either get no air bubbles or a couple small bubbles, depending on the speed you withdraw the needle from the BAC vial. I'd guess gauge of the needle might factor in a bit as well.

Click to expand...
Click to expand...
Wait, I just want to know if you can get most of the 30 ml out of the bottle before the vacuum gets too strong to be able to reasonably pull any. Cause if you can, Ima quit pushing air in before I pull an equivalent amount of bac. I thought that was just a thing you had to do, same as if you were drawing from vials (which I admittedly haven't done in a good long while).
 
randompersonrandom said:


Wait, I just want to know if you can get most of the 30 ml out of the bottle before the vacuum gets too strong to be able to reasonably pull any. Cause if you can, Ima quit pushing air in before I pull an equivalent amount of bac. I thought that was just a thing you had to do, same as if you were drawing from vials (which I admittedly haven't done in a good long while).

Click to expand...
Click to expand...
If you're using 31 gauge needles, good luck!

If you're using 30 gauge (or larger) needles, I haven't personally went down to the last drop of a BAC vial, but don't see why this would be a problem. If it eventually became a problem, you could add back in a small amount of air at that point.

It's not so much that a small amount of air is going to cause any significant contamination problem (this is BAC water, after all), but rather that the more oxygen you introduce to the vial, the more potential you're creating for benzoic acid to slowly oxidize. Or at least that's my thinking.

Of course, when you're dealing with peptides in a vial, the same logic applies, but to a greater extent (since peptides are presumably more fragile/reactive than benzoic acid).
 
tubby said:


If you're using 31 gauge needles, good luck!

If you're using 30 gauge (or larger) needles, I haven't personally went down to the last drop of a BAC vial, but don't see why this would be a problem. If it eventually became a problem, you could add back in a small amount of air at that point.

It's not so much that a small amount of air is going to cause any significant contamination problem (this is BAC water, after all), but rather that the more oxygen you introduce to the vial, the more potential you're creating for benzoic acid to slowly oxidize. Or at least that's my thinking.

Of course, when you're dealing with peptides in a vial, the same logic applies, but to a greater extent.

Click to expand...
Click to expand...

Hell, the only time something goes into my bac bottle is when I'm reconning, and those needles are 25g. I might as well quit putting air in and tell my ma to do the same; it's a good point that why add air before I have to?
 
Back
Top