5byfive
Explorer
He is just here to pick fights. If he doesn't get bored and go away soon he'll get banned.
Dedicated Hospira Bac Water Updates
- Thread starter RicFlair
- Start date
BNLFL
Explorer
Let's hope.
RaveBaddie
Explorer
If he keeps being unreasonable for no reason then I'm glad there's always the 'ignore' option
dndgeek
Explorer
How far past the expiration would you trust a bottle of hospira?
RicFlair
Explorer
I have seen some people quote in this forum, that an unopened vial of hospira realistically lasts years, not sure about an exact number, but way past the expiration date on the vials. Those are only to be followed by those in a pharmaceutical environment but for us researchers, in regards to sterility and potency, it lasts way beyond that.
Brandon556
Explorer
Im not advocating doing this but Im using a bottle i found in my cabinet thats 3-4 years old and was half empty. We will expire before bac water does. Its just water and benzyl alcohol. The only risk is bacteria growth from contamination or if it wasn't steril to begin with.
TazaTaza
Explorer
Vendor water price range is usually ~$0.1-$0.5/mL for waters, how much cheaper is it homebrew and is the money saved worth the risk with your health? What is a ridiculous price? Where are you getting cheap bulk SWFI that's less than that?
I do not do all of that.
I literally transfer my BAC into my pep, and keep it moving. I keep it super simple. The less steps the better.
Look, go ahead and make your homebrew BAC water for yourself and your gf + sister. It's no sweat off my back.
And to be clear, it is disingenuous for you to think it's "simple" to make BAC, if it was that simple this whole thread would not exist. There would be plenty of suppliers overflowing with validated and trusted BAC. You and others are too blasé + cavalier about this, which is just dangerous.
You adding lab graded BA to sterile water doesn't mean it's validated, and verifiably sterile BAC water. There is no testing or validation on that or ur raw materials. It's not a sure thing. If you are in the US there are various ways to obtain BAC or SWFI that doesn't involve homebrewing & hoping for the best. It's super reckless for no reason. Plenty of sites/resellers, H water is $11-$13/bottle before shipping.
Go ahead and make your BAC, but do not try to downplay it for what it is or get super defensive about it. If you can't afford BAC then maybe this grey market stuff isn't for you, you probably shouldn't be using them at all, no?
TazaTaza
Explorer
I am in a thread trying to discourage ppl homebrewing your own BAC, and you're hoping I get banned, why? I'm not here to pick fights, how am I picking a fight?
No I am "not going away". If you disagree with me, like the other person mentioned you can just click "ignore".
lol at "much aggression", I'm not aggressive bc you feel like you're wrong or losing in this conversation. I am not angry either.
And nice convenient excuse you have nothing to prove, just a reminder you claimed "the friend" has a COA for their homebrew. I am still patiently waiting for you to drop the COA you brought up, so I'm guessing that was a lie. Bc if ppl are cheap enough to make their own BAC, they're for sure not dropping hundreds for a full panel of testing it lol. Backwards at that point they can get a case of H Water lol.
Of course, everyone is free to do whatever they want. You can homebrew your own BAC. However, don't downplay it as if it's not reckless and has its own associated risks. It is risky to source BA for inj, water for inj, sterile water for inj, and to combine them and hope you have sterile, pH balanced BAC that is safe for inj. I'm here to remind everyone of the stakes. Mind you I never said I used name brand, so I'm guessing you're putting words in my mouth? Projection.
I made it clear, if you are in the US, you don't have to resort to homebrewing your own BAC water. I get it ya know I have empathy, ppl are sensitive and insecure about it bc I do feel it is embarrassing/uncomfortable to get desperate enough to homebrew solution you are injecting into your body w/lab sourced reagents vs having some dignity with getting the BAC via a legitimate channel.
It is not aggression at all, and I did not have the intentions of putting words in your mouth unless I accidentally mixed up replying to you or another user on here (the one homebrewing BAC for themselves + their sister and gf). If you're not in the US, good luck with the homebrewed BAC.
RaveBaddie
Explorer
Ooooo nice! You've got a colorprinter!bay_area_schizo said:
used M2 niimbot on holographic label...looked so cool. next kit I'll do better
Click to expand...
I bought a Phomemo M220 and I love the holographic labels!
Makes me feel like I'm using 'professional' peptides instead of being a chemist from 'Breaking Bad'
TazaTaza
Explorer
I don't have the mentality of peps vs prescription meds. I won't ever promote experimental, grey (sounds softer than black technically all peps are blk market but I digress) market drugs to my loved ones. I tell everyone IRL to go to L**yDirect if they have the $$$ or insurance to cover it, 9/10 insurance covers it for them.SeaGypsy said:
Not gonna lie, I have promoted a few peps to loved onesif I feel it's something that could possibly benefit their situation. Just started my own mom on GLOW to try and help her arthritic joints. If it helps her without her having to take prescription meds everyday I'll call it a win. I've only recommend peps I have used and noticed benefits from. You do you and let others do what they do.
Click to expand...
If I had a choice, of course I would pick prescription over this, like yeah if my insurance improved my TR script I would not be here.
I think my main point with the comment of not promoting it, is I see a very cavalier attitude when it comes to peps. To the point ppl are comfortably encouraging others on a thread to homebrew BAC. Take that convo to the DMs or backchannels. I think it's inappropriate to discuss it on this thread.
We are on a thread about updates on H Bac waters, and ppl are explaining to others how to make it themselves as if it's foolproof. It's bad enough the peps are risky, now let's be risky w/the inj solution? Where is the risk mitigation?
TM Water (the same water ppl thought was a safe bet) was just busted for manipulating Vanguard COAs where they failed having enough BA in it. Allegedly they've failed multiple COAs.
The temperature in this BAC water situation is rising, and ppl are desperate so no I don't think it's acceptable to promote how to homebrew BAC on a thread where vulnerable ppl are trying to find sources to find legitimate BAC water.
TazaTaza
Explorer
No, it's not extra stoichiometry. There is no chemical rxn here or so I hope. It's a dilution/solution.
You are a novice who is influenced into thinking you can safely make your own BAC water using "stoichiometry". Did you hold this viewpoint before this thread?
And then using a logic fallacy of being extreme by saying "it isn't dark magick or anything crazy". This is wild to witness in real time someone becoming more comfortable w/riskier behaviors due to being desperate from H Bac shortage/price rise. Desperation normalizes risk. When people can't access something they believe they need, they lower their standards for what counts as "safe enough."
Also, reconstituting peptides at home is comparable to what happens at a medical facility, nurses are NOT in a clean room when they reconstitute vials. They use sterile, pharma grade BAC water + aseptic technique. The BAC water is not homebrewed in a home kitchen.
This shouldn't even be a conversation on a thread where ppl are trying to find legitimate H Bac. Alternatives is finding other legitimate sources of BAC water. Baby steps. The jump to homebrew doesn't make sense...
BNLFL
Explorer
Well it does to those who live overseas like @RaveBaddie and a whole bunch more here who don't have access to Hospira like here in the US.
TazaTaza
Explorer
Even non-USA ppl, the jump to homebrew still doesn't make sense bc they still have access to resellers who sell "3P tested" BAC water and they are EU based and deliver to the EU. And/or access various vendors BAC water etc. Ppl are just being cheap.
And like I said, this convo doesn't even need to be had in a thread where ppl are seeking legitimate H water. If they can't even access H water why are they even on this thread? They came on this thread to promote homebrewing BAC water, that could be in a dedicated thread, backchannels or DMs.
So wait a second. You're telling me you use vendor bac water, reconstitute your shit, and then don't filter any of that? And you think DIY bac water is some big, ridiculous risk? Are you serious? So not only are you trusting the peptides themselves to be completely sterile, you're trusting the vials, the bac water, and everything else? Even though later in this thread you acknowledge there's a manufacturer who got in trouble for failing COAs because they didn't have enough BA in their water?
As I've said multiple times, I haven't decided yet on what I'm going to do moving forward. Maybe I'll find a vendor whose price I can afford. Maybe I'll source SWFI and add BA to it myself. Who knows. My only issue with this entire argument is that people act like bac water is this magical, unknown, mythical thing and it's just not. It's literally sterile water and benzyl alcohol. That's it. It's not crazy to think people could do that safely in their own homes, if you already accept that you can reconstitute peptides safely in your own home.
This thread exists because people don't seem to understand what exactly bac water is or how it's made. IMO, it might very well be safer to add BA to SWFI if that's all you can get, which is the case for a lot of people in the world. Bac water isn't a thing in Europe but they're using the same peptides we are, so they're almost certainly not throwing the vial away after a single use, since obviously the vial itself has multiple doses in it. If you go back to my first response here, that's one of the questions I originally asked. It seems to me like it'd be more dangerous to use SWFI without any preservatives at all, than to add your own benzyl alcohol to it.
I'm not defensive about DIYing bac water. I came looking for information from someone who's actually done it and it's incredibly frustrating that any time this question comes up or anyone brings it up as a possibility, a bunch of people jump up claiming it's not safe. Specifically, people who've never done it, have no experience with it, and can't even reasonably explain what the actual problem would be without exaggeration and hyperbole. But sure, yeah, because I can't afford insanely price gouged bac water that literally costs more per ml than my peps cost per mg, that means I shouldn't be doing this at all. Cool, okay, guess I just won't continue to improve my/my family's life with these incredible drugs?
Honestly, the cognitive dissonance is fascinating to me. What makes you so sure that adding benzyl alcohol in a very simple ratio (this seems to piss you off for some reason, but the fact is -- it is a simple ratio! Bac water ranges from .9 to 1.5% so it's not like the math is difficult or so small that the risk of adding too much is catastrophic) to SWFI is such a terrible idea? Can you explain that to me without being a prick or acting like it's so different than reconstituting your peptides? It's the dishonesty about it that gets to me, and maybe people don't even realize they're doing it because they've been conditioned into believing certain things without ever examining why they believe those things. It's like people who believe that the 28 day rule for bac water is infallible, without considering that rule is mainly in place for clinical settings, who are almost definitely piercing the vial multiple times a day, from multiple people, some of whom may not have the best aseptic technique because they're in a rush at work, unlike us at home who can take as long as we'd like to make things as sterile as reasonably possible.
I'll end this by reiterating once again, I'm not encouraging anyone to do anything. Do I think it'd be best if everyone could source Hospira bac water easily and affordably? Yes, of course. But with that clearly not being the case, I just think we as a community should be open to alternatives without judging others for the choices they make for themselves.
TazaTaza
Explorer
Currently in GBs with full testing (m/p, sterility, endotoxins).
I came here to find H BAC water sources, not watch people promote DIY homebrew. This isn't the thread for that.
If you're in the US, you have other paths to BAC water. Homebrew is unnecessary risk. You don't see the risk? Fine. But lurkers should know there are safer options.
You think vendor water is risky but you + others THINK you can produce better than labs with proper equipment, testing, and thousands of customers who 3P test their peps + water? lol NOPE. So yeah u judge me for using vendor water, but I can't judge DIY water lmao. This ties back to the cavalier attitude, homebrew water will always be ranked at the very bottom of all water sources. It's untested, not validated on multiple levels.
I'm waiting on Ocean BAC (overseas pharma) and next H Water GB. You're homebrewing to save money. The materials cost could buy you real BAC water or even H water just in a smaller quantity.
Risks with homebrew BAC:
- Non-sterile materials from incorrect sourcing
- Poor aseptic technique
- Wrong BA concentration
- No endotoxin or sterility testing
- .22 filter won't remove endotoxins, viruses, or chemical contaminants
- It will never be sterile from the jump
Deonitis
Explorer
I was always told when I got into this that if it isn’t cloudy use it. Same with the peps.
BNLFL
Explorer
Ordered on 5/22 and will be here Saturday 6/6. A touch over 2 weeks.
BNLFL
Explorer
Well added that guy to the list.
