Bacteriostatic Sodium Chloride-Compatible Compounds

Dos-Dox

Dos-Dox

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Ever since I accidentally bought a combination deal containing half regular Hospira BAC and half Hospira SC BAC, I’ve been digging into compounds that are safe to reconstitute with BAC saline. (I was paying attention to the expiration dates and didn’t notice the subtle “SC” in the description.)

For those that don’t know, bacteriostatic sodium chloride contains a target of 0.9% benzyl alcohol in sodium chloride (saline) instead of 0.9% benzyl alcohol in sterile water.

So far, I’ve compiled the following lists for compounds that have reportedly been reconstituted with BAC sodium chloride with no issues and some that you definitely can’t use saline for. These are all anecdotal reports from various users across various platforms. It should be noted that there may be variances between different manufacturers that could affect the same pep differently when reconned with BAC SC.

Reportedly Compatible with Saline:

  • GHK-Cu
  • SS-31
  • MOTS-C
  • Tirz (this is probably the largest reported peptide used with BAC SC)
  • Sema
  • Glutathione
  • Tox
Reportedly Incompatible with Saline:

  • Reta (big NO NO on this one!)
  • Tesa
  • CJC
  • Ipa
  • Tirz or Sema with improper finishing/too many TFA salts.
Why some researchers consider using BAC saline instead of regular BAC:

  • Spicy Peps - Regular BAC is hypotonic and forces water into the cells, which can cause some swelling and stinging. BAC SC is isotonic, matching human tissue osmolarity. This means there’s no gradient, so reduced swelling and pain.
  • Cost - BAC SC is cheaper than regular BAC. (At the time of this post, Hospira BAC SC is less than half the cost of Hospira BAC.)
  • Availability - if you can’t get regular BAC, it may be a viable alternative for some peps.
  • You made a hasty purchase and didn’t realize you were buying BAC SC (i.e. me)
I have personally made a nasal spray with N.A. Semax Amidate and didn’t notice any issues, but am not ready to put that on the safe list yet.

Now, the real reason for the post: I’d like to know what all I can safely use this BAC SC with and am looking for more user experiences. What other peptides have you successfully reconstituted with BAC sodium chloride? Alternately, which ones have you tried and were unsuccessful (usually cloudy/gelled)?
 
I will be watching this thread.

If I don't cut GHK-Cu with Basic, a vial lasts me just under 4 weeks putting it right in the sweet spot on recommended safe use.

Thank you for this!
 
yeddie said:


I wonder if GLOW or KLOW might be compatible with saline, and whether it would make the pin a bit less "spicy".

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Yeah, I’m hoping someone will chime in to say what the results were if they did BPC or TB4 by themselves or one of the blends before.
 
yeddie said:


I wonder if GLOW or KLOW might be compatible with saline, and whether it would make the pin a bit less "spicy".

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the spicy comes from ghkcu and not bac water, so I doubt if the saline version would help. I actually just use kpv and wolverine to avoid ghkcu completely as it was never studied for injection, but works great topically. As far as bac, lambda and genetek have worked fine for me, along with hospira of course. I would never use vendor bac water though, you know they just throw that stuff together in someone's backroom lol
 
I found a helpful post in Peppy’s that said using BAC SC for NAD+ was very helpful in greatly reducing the sting, making the NAD dissolve much faster, and was still crystal clear days after recon. So, here’s the updated running lists:

Reportedly Compatible with Saline:

  • GHK-Cu
  • SS-31
  • MOTS-C
  • Tirz (this is probably the largest reported peptide used with BAC SC)
  • Sema
  • Glutathione
  • Tox
  • NAD+
Reportedly Incompatible with Saline:

  • Reta (big NO NO on this one!)
  • Tesa
  • CJC
  • Ipa
  • Tirz or Sema with improper finishing/too many TFA salts
 
AI slop attached, for consideration/ridicule. Basically, a number of peptides like KPV, Epi, BPC, and TB do better with saline BAC than the GLPs. Though the GLPs like sema and tirz are commercially available with NaCl (sodium chloride), they also have more buffers to prevent microscopic aggregation.
 
Calm Logic said:


AI slop attached, for consideration/ridicule. Basically, a number of peptides like KPV, Epi, BPC, and TB do better with saline BAC than the GLPs. Though the GLPs like sema and tirz are commercially available with NaCl (sodium chloride), they also have more buffers to prevent microscopic aggregation.

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Hi Calm Logic!

Just to clarify...

RE: Tirzepatide - "Fails entirely in saline without heavy pharmaceutical shields."

What the heck is a heavy pharmaceutical shield?

Monjourno (tirzepatide) is shipped to patients already reconstituted with PBS in pens.

Am I to therefore assume that PBS (Phosphate Buffered Saline) is a "heavy pharmaceutical shield"?
 
That’s a very interesting analysis. Thank you for taking the time to research and compile the summary! There are a lot that line up with the user experiences I found and a few that conflict (like NAD+).

You are right that the BAC NaCl is slightly more acidic than BAC sterile water. Per the Hospira datasheets, the target pH of BAC SC is 5.0 compared to a target for regular BAC of 5.7. Both have an acceptable range of 4.5-7.0, so may explain why sometimes it works and sometimes it doesn’t for certain peps that may be more sensitive to pH.

I still believe there’s an ionic component at play that shift the solubility of different compound in different diluents, but it’s been a long time since I walked out of a chemistry classroom and I’ve been unwilling to dust the cobwebs from that section of my brain lately.

Based on the user experiences I found showing tesa, CJC, and IPA cloud or gel with BAC NaCl, I’d probably avoid using it with any of the GHRHs or GHRPs and that conservatism is supported by the summary you provided as well.

I am still hoping more users will contribute their experiences with different peps. I will probably sacrifice one of the peps I have a decent amount of (like BPC, or TB4, or KPV) to the experiment the next time I recon one of them.

Thanks for the reconstitution reconnaissance! 😉
 
AlexSilver said:


What the heck is a heavy pharmaceutical shield?

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Dramatic language since AI has emotional needs for attention.

AlexSilver said:


Monjourno (tirzepatide) is shipped to patients already reconstituted with PBS in pens.

Am I to therefore assume that PBS (Phosphate Buffered Saline) is a "heavy pharmaceutical shield"?

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Yes:

Gemini said:


"Heavy pharmaceutical shield" simply meant a precisely engineered phosphate buffer that manipulates the peptide's electrical charge.

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So now the question is: Should people reconning tirz or sema with saline BAC consider adding drops of PBS? Gemini's answer is no, to just use regular BAC:

Gemini said:


Every time you introduce a new liquid, syringe, or step into the reconstitution process, you increase the risk of bacterial contamination and human error. Mixing unbuffered saline BAC with drops of lab-grade PBS to reconstitute a naked mannitol puck is creating a "Frankenstein" solution with unknown osmolality, unknown final pH, and no guaranteed stability.

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Dos-Dox said:


Reta (big NO NO on this one!)

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I had no idea and saw some Youtube of Peter (Jano) say no one sells bac water in EU. Well, it sucked; stung during pinning and was cloudy as hell. Now I only use bac water with everything.
 
Continuing to add to the lists as I run across more anecdotal user experiences. A user reported that he recons unbuffered ARA-290 and it recons crystal clear with no issues. This aligns with the Gemini assessment of low risk for ARA that @Calm Logic posted as well. So, updated lists:

Reportedly Compatible with BAC NaCl:

  • GHK-Cu
  • SS-31
  • MOTS-C
  • Tirz (this is probably the largest reported peptide used with BAC SC)
  • Sema
  • Glutathione
  • Tox
  • NAD+
  • ARA-290
Reportedly Incompatible with BAC NaCl:

  • Reta (big NO NO on this one!)
  • Tesa
  • CJC
  • Ipa
  • Tirz or Sema with improper finishing/too many TFA salts
 
With gluta, the concern with saline is oxidation. So better to use sooner or later, or use regular BAC and then add saline or saline BAC for greater dilution/comfort to the same syringe. Even with all that, I still do IM for gluta to prevent ISRs (the vl muscle in the thigh).
 
I just tried my 1st vial w Tirz in the Bac Saline & it worked perfectly so far

I read somewhere that reta from the trials has also been in saline like their Tirz. Maybe finished differently?
 
I reconned KPV and GHK-Cu with BAC saline a few days ago and everything is still crystal clear, so I’m adding KPV to the list. As a reminder, the list is solely based on reported user experiences.

Reportedly Compatible with BAC NaCl:

  • GHK-Cu
  • SS-31
  • MOTS-C
  • Tirz (this is probably the largest reported peptide used with BAC SC)
  • Sema
  • Glutathione
  • Tox
  • NAD+
  • ARA-290
  • KPV
Reportedly Incompatible with BAC NaCl:

  • Reta (big NO NO on this one!)
  • Tesa
  • CJC
  • Ipa
  • Tirz or Sema with improper finishing/too many TFA salts
 
I attempted to recon oxytocin for nasal use using 0.9% sterile saline. It gelled up. Granted, this was not saline BAC. It is one I would be very careful with.
 
Did you try the same kit of oxytocin with regular BAC?

Oxytocin seems to be a pain in general for recon. The one time I tried to recon, I had issues using regular BAC/Hospira.
 
Calm Logic said:


Did you try the same kit of oxytocin with regular BAC?

Oxytocin seems to be a pain in general for recon. The one time I tried to recon, I had issues using regular BAC/Hospira.

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I didn't. I always use it as a nasal spray, and don't use BAC in my snoot sprays (it hurts!).
 
Any findings on Maz? I have looked sporadically and havent found anything. I have a kit in the freezer and BAC NaCl on the way. I will gladly mix a vial if someone can tell me what all to look for. I think after 60 days is degradation becomes a problem with Maz(I will double check) so I can keep in the fridge and document findings.
 
Calm Logic said:


AI slop attached, for consideration/ridicule. Basically, a number of peptides like KPV, Epi, BPC, and TB do better with saline BAC than the GLPs. Though the GLPs like sema and tirz are commercially available with NaCl (sodium chloride), they also have more buffers to prevent microscopic aggregation.

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I can't remember whose protocol I follow, but I made a saline nasal spray of TB-500 and it works just fine, so I would assume SQ isn't any different.
 
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